Most misogynists, it would seem, are loath to admit that they’re misogynists. “How can you say I hate women?” they’ll ask. “After all, I love my sister. She’s not like the rest of those whores.” Or, “I just hate Western Women.” Or whatever fine distinction they like to make to pretend that their hatred of pretty much every woman they ever come across, or imagine in their overheated little brains, is something other than misogyny.
Then there are those who not only admit their misogyny but who are downright proud of it, thinking it’s a sign of their own personal superiority. Today, a pretty good example of Proud Misogyny, taken from the reactionary Christian blog Samson’s Jawbone.
Our intrepid woman-hater starts off by contrasting his brand of misogyny to the peculiar kind of woman-appreciation advocated by the PUA gasbag now known as Heartiste (but still known as Roissy when this post was written):
Roissy is fond of saying that he’s not a “misogynist”; no, learning the unvarnished truth about female psychology has given him a *higher* appreciation for women. Not so for me. Sociosexual philosophy has disillusioned me beyond all reckoning. Peering deep into the psyche of woman has rendered me grievously scornful in feeling and mercilessly unscrupulous in behaviour towards these unholy, ungodly beings. I venture to say that… I hate them. Yes, I hate them! And how could I not?
Did I mention that he has literary pretensions as well? Like a lot of reactionaries, Mr. Jawbone has adopted a melodramatic, vaguely archaic prose style that he evidently feels is the height of literary sophistication, but which sounds a lot more like the monologuing of some cartoon villain.
Oh, the vile criteria by which women judge menfolk! O, abominable, loathsome beings!
Is anyone else reminded of Newman from Seinfeld?
But Mr. Jawbone is just getting started:
A creature so damnably constituted as to admire a man for his “social dominance” – by which is meant his ability to waltz through an absurd series of meaningless, contrived riddles – rather than his work ethic, his self-sacrifice, his affability, his charity, his honesty, his justice – in short, his righteousness and integrity; such a creature deserves to be used and abused like a cheap street harlot – or better yet, a vermin-ridden ass – and discarded appropriately. Nothing more; she merits nothing better.
Here’s an actual vermin-ridden ass, having a nice scratch in the dirt:
Oh, but Mr. Jawbone isn’t done yet:
Words like “honour”, “duty”, “kindness”… those things that define goodness and rightness… all meaningless, meaningless to this wretched, wicked half of the human race. And do women who profess belief in something “higher”; women who should know better, afford any solace? No. Instead they show themselves as fraudulent, fickle hellcats who think good men are “weak”. So alas, I can no longer view the distaff horde with anything besides revulsion and contempt. They perjure themselves by their own words; they are beasts, deserving nothing but callous treatment and damnation; and I can wish nothing upon them but furious hatred, ignominy and a miserable passing.
What a cheery fellow!
I take no joy in penning the above – but I feel clean and spotless as the lamb. What else is to be said for a lot that believes black to be white, up to be down, and good men to be worthless? Poor Ashley Wilkes, and all good men.
Hate to break it to you, dude, but you’re not actually a good man. You’re a pompous dickbag. Oh, sorry, you’re a base, proud, shallow, beggarly, three-suited, hundred-pound, filthy, worsted-stocking knave!
(Thanks to Shakespeare for that last insult, and to Quackers for pointing me to Mr. Jawbone’s post.)
Oh my god how did I miss this, I made a Troll appear! And he claims to be a Cathar?!
Please excuse my Historian squeal of joy.
Going from his first post, I love how I start by saying that I am so thankful for my free Pill and this apparently means I have an entitlement complex.
You must know me so well Raymond to be able to tell via one post on the internet about my entitlement complex.
Dear Raymond, I am a fucking taxpayer, I have paid taxes since I could toddle to the newsagents and buy stuff with my pocket money that had VAT on it. I have been paying tax on my earnings for part time jobs since I was 18 and I pay tax on some of my savings.
I have also taken far less from the state than most people as my education up to the age of 18 was private and paid for by my parents, I have therefore saved the state thousands of pounds which can be spent on providing an education for a child whose parents could not have afforded private school fees. All my dental care and work is done privately, also saving the money for someone who couldn’t afford it.
I will have paid for my god damned Pill countless times over in the years I have been spending and earning but as a student I could not afford to buy it every month on the income I have now. I didn’t mention that I’m not taking any loans from Student Finance did I? My parents are loaning me the money for my fees and my accommodation and enough for food, everything else I pay for myself from my own job.
My parents have been paying into the tax system for decades, large parts of that in the highest tax bands.
I don’t take a fucking penny more than is necessary because I don’t need it, because my parents can afford to lend me the money and I have a good paying job during the holidays.
You are not paying for my sodding Pill, I am getting a fraction of the money I have paid into the system and that my parents have paid into the system back to stop myself being a huge burden on the taxpayer. I would be a hell of a lot more expensive if I had a baby wouldn’t I?
Oh and if it pleases you to know, my Pill was prescribed because of the acne I’ve suffered from since the age of 9, more than than half my life. I do use it to prevent pregnancy but that is not it’s primary purpose.
Oh and Mr Perfectus? The Cathars were massive misogynists, the Perfects refused even to touch women when they blessed them and women were not allowed to become Perfects. Women were considered dirty and more connected to the “evil” material world because of their capacity of child bearing.
I’m a Historian and I have studied the Cathars and I have spent a lot of time in the area of Southern France which was the stronghold of the sect, don’t try and argue this with me.
Fuck you. Your comments about my body, my medical choices and my economic and financial choices are none of your fucking business.
Oh and also Fuck off Diogenes. The “dummy” you were referring to was me.
If you have a problem with me getting the Pill for “free”, come say it to my face.
I AM HISTORIAN HEAR ME ROAR.
@historophilia:
A person who chooses a nym like historophilia is into history? This is inconceivable.
Diogenes: Such a libertarian fucknut you are. Have fun being second-rate.
Seriously. Frothing about the people who don’t get paid in a system that pays everybody is just plain … well. Dogmatic? Wearing ideological blinders the size of the Chrysler building? It’s something.
yes, you are indeed lucky but you suffer also from entitlement mentality that you think it’s normal to have other people (the UK taxpayer) subsidizing your lifestyle choices.
Yeah… not like Maggie Thatcher subsidising mine owners (by breaking unions, so they could exploit the miners), or privatising public housing, so the landlords could skimp on maintainence; building could slow and rents 1: go up, and 2: into private hands.
What Thatherism is still doing to Britain
There’s a redistribution of wealth by the NHS system.
Thank goodness for that (not that Present Day Tories don’t want to kill it… which Thatcher knew she couldn’t… sort of like Reagan and SS, it took the decades of having fucked the debate for their repsective parties to get to the meat of the matter).
It’s not that you are against redistributing wealth, it’s that you want it to become more concentrated, and I want it to be more even.
To be sexually active is a choice. It may be true that the increase in unwanted pregnancies will be more expensive for the NHS than paying for contraception (I doubt it), but as a matter of principle I hate it if people hold me hostage like “if you don’t subsidize my behavior, I will recklessly continue anyway and then it will become even more expensive”.
Whut? If they get NHS supported delivery/abortions they are still “holding you hostage”, but it costs more. So…
Right, it’s actually about the, “to be sexually active is a choice.”
Yes, contraception has uses for certain medical conditions, but that’s something completely different.
The primary condition for which is is useful is… pregnancy. And do you think men should stop having sex if the women can’t afford the pill?
Neo cathar? and a perfectus? So you’ve stopped eating? Also… the Cathars weren’t as holy as a all that (I commend, “Montaillou, The Promised Land of Error” for what Catharism meant in practice.
But dude, if you think you ought to be allowed to impose your religious beliefs on others, I reccomend a Cholla Loofa, and hand washing your prickly pears before you fetter.
Also, as a Cathar, you should be ALL FOR REDISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH. It’s a prime tenet of Catharism. Moreover, while sex is sinful (and in part because it leads to more people, which perpetuates the struggle between good ane evil), it’s not a prime tenet of the faith that all people must refrain and, because the great problem is procreation; not pleasure (hence the acceptance of non-procreative sex), the Pill should be something you not only approve, but evangelise.
Moron.
This is a hostile place, where you have absolutely no respect for for other peoples faith.
Says the dude who tells people who have a faith which isn’t all in arms about the fucking that they have to stop. Pot, Kettle. Hypocrite.
You, son, are far from being ready to take the consolatum.
Naïf: You want to be all independent, be all independent on your own dime.
I mean it. Go mine the silver, make the dies, mint the coins and find a way to spend them. Don’t buy a car with “fiat” money. Don’t drive on roads you didn’t build (or aren’t using those self-made dimes to pay tolls on).
Don’t buy food that travelled on subsidised roads, was grown with distributed water, etc.
You can’t live the way you live without socialism; you just don’t like that other people benefit too.
Have fun. I’m just not paying for your contraception, or, in the absence of that, your crotch-fruit.
And you say you aren’t a misogynist. Interesting choice of metaphor. Not, “other people’s children”, but, “your crotch-fruit”.
I know you’re not here now, but other peoples work isn’t a right of yours.
Which is why you don’t use anything you didn’t pay for with your personal labor; from start to finish, with no portion of the total cost absorbed by any other, and are happy to pay your fair share of the costs of any such thing from which you do benefit (Food Safety Inspections, Roads, Defense, Clean Water, Certification of Doctors and other professionals, drug approval; and monitoring).
Oh wait you are against most of those, and freeloading on the people who pay willingly.
So you are more than just a hypocrite, you are a thieving hypocrite.
Raymond, Imperfectus: Also, please don’t mock my title “Perfectus”, you don’t need to use it, but don’t mock it.
You ain’t close to being a Perfectus. Accepting that fact is the first step to, pehaps, attaining it. But at present, you don’t have a hope. Then again, looking at the rank hypocrisy of many of the Perfectus in the past, you might be right. But damned if I am going to call you one. Why? Because you are pretending to a level of sanctity your actions belie.
Though I do apologise for mistyping the Consolamentum.
I missed the viagra, it’s bad that I have to pay for that, too (still it’s not as much connected with procreative sex).
Um… dude… the whole point of the pill is that it’s to contravene procreative sex. Viagra is just about fucking, and encourages sex; procreation is the predictable outcome of sex which has no contraception.
So you are just making this up as you go along, so you can slag on “the slutty sluts who fuck”.
That doesn’t convince me. If a disorder is diagnosed and contraceptives are needed as a treatment,
But viagra, which is prescribed for the disorder of, “guy can’t get it up to fuck” isn’t as bad as a pill to prevent procreation.
Again, you aren’t making your case here.
I read the article. I don’t want birth control to be banned or not paid for in special circumstances.
So you admit to being a theocrat. Odd, in a Gnostic. Where then is the room for Gnosis? If one is compelled to good behavior how can it be freely engaged in? What of the general urge to rebel? How, when all are forced to emulate, can those who are Perfectus show the way? Is then the Consolamentum the only form of truly perfected example?
You are denying those who have yet to have their moment of Gnostic revelation the ability to attain the clean break with the past which Perfection ought to bring about. Better you should take up Zen.
But there are few cases as extreme as that, that people who don’t have sex (maybe just because they can’t find a partner) have to subsidize other people enjoying themselves in the most primitive way.
What? Damn. The Most Primitive Way is being subsidised? Where do I get my firewood? What sort of drum will be provided?
Also, though surely not everybody will use publicly founded libraries, museums etc. or view public broadcasting, they could do it instantly, if they just wanted to.
Because the Smithsonian is so close to Salina, Kansas.
re snails: I am sure they have consciousness. Plants have it, so snails must.
How much they have, I can’t say. I’d say not much. Are they sapient? No. I am pretty sure there are non-human creatures on the planet who are sapient, but I don’t know which ones (though I have some strong opinions in favor of some; e.g. the corvids).
katz: I’m still waiting for an explanation of why sex is what connects things to the material world, and for that matter why he doesn’t just cut eating out of his life altogether to maintain his bodily purity.
That’s the next step in the Cathar progression to sanctity. Basically a Dualist notion of deity, and the world is not a Godly Creation, but one of a lesser being; souls were/are tricked into inhabiting bodies.
One who believes, but is weak in practice was referred to as Credens (this was in France, along the Pyrenees, primarily in the Languedoc). One who was both good in behavior, and steeped in the theology could become Perfectus; this was not, exactly, a self-declared status (though as the persecutions became more effective, there was more self-declaration). The “sex as procreative is most evil” shows up later in the era (Catharism was pretty widespread in the region, for about 150 years, prior to the Albigensian Crusade, and lingered for about a century after that), and was used by some perfecti to say that oral/anal sex was acceptable; since it couldn’t trap another soul into the evils of the world.
But mostly they used it as a way to convince credulous Credentes to let them sleep with them (and those Perfecti tended to say that they were holy enough that it wasn’t a sin at all; to have sex with them. Some even said it was sacramental. They also tended to preach that marriage was a tool of the Demiurge, and so the limits of marital fidelity were actually sinful).
Among other things they were supposed to abstain from meat, milk, eggs, sex (in theory failing in this meant one lost status as Perfectus, in practice many sophistries were in use; esp; in the most detailed period of knowledge* as a means to avoid suspicion. This wasn’t as well honored as our friend here would have us think. It was also a tenet that Credentes should strive for it, but it was understood that the temptations of the world were strong, and renunciation hard. Never was it a tenet of faith to force others to adhere to practice.
The final expression of devotion was to “take the consolamentum”, and cease to eat, abstain from sexual contact of any sort, and die.
The basic tenets of Catharism are interesting, and parallel a lot of utopian thinking (see Oneida, Joeseph Smith), and it might have grown into an interesting religion, had it not been so effectively suppressed. Unlike the Shakers they weren’t completely renouncing sex, and it seems the level of renunciation increased as persecution went up; so absent the Inquisition it’s possible they would have evolved to something interesting.
But they are, basically, a dead letter. An interesting set of ideas that most who adopt are playing at (as with Dan Halloran’s Neo-Nordic Paganism).
*the final period of the Inquisition; btw, almost no Cathars were killed in the tailing off, though some committed suicide, most by taking the consolamentum, and starving themselves before the inquisition got to them. It was seen as a problematic, but not dangerous heresy; mostly because it was hard, and required people to adopt almost monastic attitudes, while living in the world. The last 50 years ebbed and flowed, but new adherents stopped happening. It was also on the fringes of society, being largely the practice of sheepherds (in part because that kept them away from the inquisition), and so both scattered (so that it looks large on a map of, “The Area of the Cathars”) and hard to transmit from one community to another.
Raymond Imperfectus: The modern nation is just some sort of club where the arbitrariness of your birth place decides if you become a member and you’re entitled to all the good things like health care.
And you want to make it worse. Really good job of looking after other beings with the spark of the divine.
So what prevents the money from flowing right now?
Selfish fucks like you who think their philosophical beliefs justify harming others.
Argenti: I’ve thought about it. No guillotine for me. I saw on (a portable one) in Ukraine (from a concentration camp). It chilled me in way a trapdoor gallows, or a firing squad doesn’t.
Now I have to tend some plants, get some food, and go to work.
Raymond, if you want to dance, I’ll be back.
Ooh, is Raymond gonna put his money where his mouth is? Will you pay for my nursing education, RayBans? I’m a good investment in helping out other humans, and going to nursing school will be a bit of a cockblock to boot! ;D
Yeah, the bit about ‘but if you don’t go into shock you might remain conscious and aware… for the entire length of time it takes your brain to oxygen-starve…’
Eep.
Raymond Imperfectus: but I know what they believe!
Regale me. Tell me of my beliefs? Where do I stand on the 99 Theses, and the Diet of Worms.
What are my thought on the making of Nel-pot coffee. What is my position on Catharism?
Do you speak so condescendingly about similar neo-movements
Of movements? Depends on the movement. FLDS… fuck yeah. Neo-paganism? As a movement? No. Practitioners? Yes, when they are pathetic posers using it to valorise their prejudicial beliefs and harm others.
You bet yer bippy I do.
Pecunium, you don’t need to explain what Catharism is. I’m just having fun watching the troll flail for explanations to a belief set that he clearly hasn’t thought through past “the rules say so and, uh, The Matrix.”
Here’s a good one for our little pseudo enlightened Wikipedia user – what is my ethical and philosophical position on Islam?
Also, what do I believe is the tastiest type of tea?
Re: methods of execution — if you’re lucky, gallows snap your neck (which is functionally the same as the guillotine, just less bloody), firing squad…again, either death by exsanguination, or a shot to the head, the later might be faster as it destroys the brain rather than cutting it’s blood flow. Until execution by carbon monoxide becomes a thing, I’d rather not count on firing squads being able to aim, nor hanging causing unconsciousness (cuz if it doesn’t? Same effect as guillotine)
Seems entirely unlikely that the brain would have enough oxygen to maintain consciousness, not be fully and totally dead, sure, but blood pressure must drop damned fast when the heart and brain are in two separate locations (disclaimer: my lovely array of psych drugs come with blood pressure checks cuz I’ve been known to faint from standing up to fast…you’re out quick with a sudden blood pressure drop, and well, brain over here, heart over there, seems rather unlikely your severed brain could maintain the blood pressure required for consciousness)
Granted, carbon monoxide aka “the silent killer” is probably most humane, assuming we’re talking about suffocation in your sleep and not gas chambers.
Re: consciousness and snails — I’ve got plants, a fern that’s got fronds (they’re adorable!), hydra, some sort of water flea type thing, snails, and cory eggs (my “empty” 10g tank is just bustling with life) — and no, I really don’t know where I’d put the “nope, not remotely conscious, sorry” line…hydra are really not that different from plants. And yeah, I always forget the scary smart birds on my list of animals that may be sapient. Lol, of course, scary smart means if my father ever does try cutting down that tree, it’s resident giant crow might have a bone to pick with him.
I’m watching a clown loach explore a silk leaf, silly fishie certainly has some clue what it’s doing. They’re certainly curious little fish. I also have a danio who’s either decided to eat PVC, or is looking for leftovers…guess it’s time to get up! (PVC makes great tunnels, the silk plants are because plec, cories, loaches…real plants wouldn’t stand a chance, and cranky attacks plastic plants)
Argenti, with firing squads it’s my recollection that you’re much, much more likely to go into shock instantly. Going into shock = pretty much best-case scenario.
Call me newfangled, but what’s wrong with a nice lethal injection? I have good veins!
Welp, there are some real horror stories about the botched amounts and people struggling and suffering through their last, um, minutes, hours… Yeah.
And the electric chair was pretty awful too.
Basically, yeah, humane execution methods is a bit of a oxymoron…
I’ve heard lots of nasties about lethal injections too.
Have I missed a reveal? People are calling trollyRay Diogenes.
And he still hasn’t turned up to face being laughed at by a king. I haz a disappoint.
Might say something about the time zone he’s in, though …
@Kitteh’s Help: Nono, Diogenes popped in for a one-off back before the troll popped, and we were just getting around to his stuff…
XD My life is now perfect XD I never knew you guys were misleading me with cute kitty pictures, I thought it was also the recipes, mockery, and nice community too. XD And, you know, the talking about the sexism, which apparently is a great evil because birth control? I have stopped following Raymond since I left. XD Also, the caffeine probably doesn’t help.
wah wah wah Ray ray hates people having sex.
@Argenti Aertheri
Wow…and that is a good example for me to understand how creepy his is… O_O