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Last week: Outraged by Kathy Griffin. Today: Wants London mayor impaled on a pike

Underneath the mask, the alt-right is still the alt-right

Here’s a little case study in alt-right hypocrisy.

Last week, like a lot of people, the wannabe self-help guru and alt-right opinion-haver who calls himself “DarkTriadMan” professed to be outraged by Kathy Griffin posing for photos with a stylized severed head of Donald Trump.

Given that DarkTriadMan’s whole schtick is based on the idea that men should act more like psychopaths if they want to get ahead in life, you wouldn’t think he’d be much bothered by Griffin’s admittedly dark stunt, but he made quite a show of his outrage, endlessly retweeting alt-right attacks on Griffin and adding his own spin to the news:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/870652822836195328

He was glad to see Griffin brought to tears by the reaction to her photos:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/870689717049634816

And fantasized about Barron Trump ultimately taking his revenge:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/869935774883500033

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/869958745186590720

Today, in the wake of latest London attacks, Mr. Dark Triad seems to have gotten over his squeamishness about Griffin’s supposed call for violence against a sitting politician. Now he’s quite openly calling for the mass slaughter of Muslims.

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871471460543602688

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871355215215304704

He’s also talking about how great it would be if the mayor of London — a sitting politician, like Trump, with two children — were to be burned at the stake.

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871354479593091072

Or impaled:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871353175466496000

Or torn apart by horses:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871352151846658048

Or blinded and hung:

https://twitter.com/DarkTriadMan/status/871352529262694400

This is more or less what I’ve come to expect from the alt-right; their “moral outrage” is almost always in very bad faith. But it’s still a little surprising to see just how blatant their hypocrisy can be.

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Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ valentine

It’s funny with language. It’s only when you (try to) learn another one that all this cases and ‘participle’ thing comes up. For example I have no idea what the ‘future imperfect’ of any word is in English. Although I have no idea what that even means anyway. When we did Latin we sort of skirted over the fundamental rules, but basically our teacher just had us engage in spoken or written conversations until it sunk in intuitively.

(we had corporal punishment at my schools so you don’t half learn quick)

Valentine
Valentine
4 years ago

Future imperfect like you say ‘i will going’ somewhere. Then future perfect like ‘i will go’. I think this is correct…

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@Alan
We don’t need verb agreement for tenses like that in English. Future imperfect is “will have been”.

Imaginary Petal
Imaginary Petal
4 years ago

The main value of using a case system is that it provides grammatical and semantic precision without needing to rely on word order. While all the inflections of the various cases might be difficult to learn, some may find it easier than truly understanding and applying the rules of word order.

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ valentine & kupo

Heh, when I try to think about this it gets like one of those time travel ontological paradox things. “I will have been going to…” etc. I think my brain just doesn’t have the wiring. Isn’t there some truth in that? Like we lose the ability to intuitively learn languages after the age of seven or something because our neuron pathways set?

Valentine
Valentine
4 years ago

Ok maybe Kupo correct about this one. Im not 100% sure now. I thought imperfect for when you doing something but not finish and then perfect for finished.

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
4 years ago

@Valentine + Alan + etc
This video talks about ‘inflectional morphology’ or tenses and cases and whatnot. Short version is that the extra words that some languages use are almost exactly the same thing as the word endings that other languages use to indicate cases. Word endings may just be extra words that attached themselves to the base word when nobody was looking

(3:50 onwards, but it’s a good vid all the way thru. Also, the intro is kinda loud, just a heads up)

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

@JS and Valentine

Oh gods, you brought up Star Trek’s Chekov, whose accent is literally impossible, because a Russian would never substitute a W for a V, because the W sound DOES NOT EXIST IN RUSSIAN ANYWHERE!! (If anything, it should have been the other way around. He should have been sticking v’s instead of w’s in words, like a German.)

Just as the “ы” vowel does not exist in English anywhere.

Regarding vowels, Russian has five primary vowels and five derived “softened” vowels, so the way it goes is this:

а (“ah”) –> я (“yah”)
э (“eh”) –> е (“yeh”)
о (“oh”) –> ё (“yoh”)
у (“ooh”) –> ю (“yu”)
ы (no English equivalent, but you can try working backwards from its complement if you want to figure out how it sounds) –> и (“eeh”)

There is also “й”, which not everybody agrees is a vowel, and it makes the same sound as “y” in the word “day” — Russian does not have a “w” equivalent, though other Slavic languages do, it looks like this “ў” and sounds like “w” in the word “how”.

For the most part Russian is highly phonetic, so what it looks like is what it sounds like. But this is somewhat thwarted in vowels. The example I like to use is the word “cow” which has the same problem in Russian as in English. The vowel in it is written as “o” but pronounced as “ah” and the same thing happens in the Russian word for cow.

Russian, however, has a handy trick for words where vowels do this. You can alter most Russian words, so that the syllable containing the suspect vowel is stressed, and in Russian whenever stress falls on a syllable, the vowel in that syllable will ALWAYS be pronounced how it is written.

This trick and the general high phoneticism of Russian means that spelling mistakes are extremely infrequent. There is in fact no such verb in Russian as “to spell.” There is a very limited number of words which you cannot change to check the content of the questionable syllable, and you learn the entire list of them in first grade. Spelling mistakes for a native Russian speaker are a sign of EXTREMELY poor education or dyslexia, because it’s almost impossible to make them.

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ Axe

Cheers for that. I’ll check it out this evening.

Or I might just file cases and participles along with maths, gyroscopes, and magnets, as things that demonstrably do work, but might as well be magic as far as I’m concerned.

Valentine
Valentine
4 years ago

Well Dashapants, i dont know about speaking but I must be honest and say when I learning before now sometimes I putting ‘wery’ for ‘very’ and also W in places where it not need to be. Yes it difficult because it not exist. And maybe Chekov accent not convincing, but he say he try to do bad one by purpose. I see also my other friends when they use english and they not as good like me they also sometimes putting W where it not need to be.

As for spelling on Russian, yes i agree! It very easy and yes sounds like it said. You only person to say this on here i think so far, but I been saying a lot already about this. It easy.

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

The most useless words in English from a Russian perspective are the definite and indefinite article, and most Russians cannot grok the point of them at all and will skip them when speaking until they get to maybe intermediate level of fluency.

And because Russian has no variable vowel duration and assigns all sounds their own letter, you will have Russians constantly pronouncing “no” as “noh” because to a Russian mind “no” the way English speakers say it should have three sounds “n”, “oh”, and “ooh” and since it doesn’t have the “ooh” bit in written form, it must be just “noh” and getting the beginners to stop “noh”ing is very difficult.

JS
JS
4 years ago

“I will have arrived” – future perfect
I have read that there is no specific “future imperfect” tense in English, though we do have 2 types of “past imperfect”.

Other odd things about English…
Nouns can be verbed, and verbs can be nouned.
Even native speakers of English disagree about how she should be spoken.

And I love Douglas Adams’ take on time travel and verb tenses…

The major problem is quite simply one of grammar, and the main work to consult in this matter is Dr Dan Streetmentioner’s Time Traveller’s Handbook of 1001 Tense Formations. It will tell you for instance how to describe something that was about to happen to you in the past before you avoided it by time-jumping forward two days in order to avoid it. The event will be described differently according to whether you are talking about it from the standpoint of your own natural time, from a time in the further future, or a time in the further past and is further complicated by the possibility of conducting conversations whilst you are actually travelling from one time to another with the intention of becoming your own mother or father.

Most readers get as far as the Future Semi-Conditionally Modified Subinverted Plagal Past Subjunctive Intentional before giving up: and in fact in later editions of the book all the pages beyond this point have been left blank to save on printing costs.

The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy skips lightly over this tangle of academic abstraction, pausing only to note that the term ‘Future Perfect’ has been abandoned since it was discovered not to be.

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

Another sound that does NOT exist in Russian is “th” so getting a Russian to pronounce “three” is some sort of peculiar torture (especially since r’s are always rolled in Russian and t’s are hard — English soft r’s and t’s are a big adjustment to make to one’s mouth, and forcing it to do all this in a single word is a challenge).

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ dashapants

The most useless words in English from a Russian perspective are the definite and indefinite article

I’ve noticed that a quick and lazy way for actors to be ‘Russian’ is to drop articles.

But now you’ve said that I’m wondering why we need them. The only possible reason is so we can have that exchange in Dr Who:

“You’re a doctor?”

“I’m the Doctor. The definite article so to speak.”

But apart from that it does seem a bit redundant.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@JS : is the transformation verb->noun and vice versa supposed to be strange ? In which language is there no similar system ?

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

@ Alan

Personally, I always wondered how the title of that show is translated into Russian, because you don’t ask “Doctor who?” in Russian. It does not work like that. You kind of can’t ask it like that. So… how can it be translated without losing the whole point of the show?

You can translate it literally, but it’s never used that way as a question in spoken language. The closest vernacular question like that is “what kind of doctor?” but it doesn’t quite have the same sense to it.

So, now that I think about it, the latest companion’s “Doctor what?” is the closest to a translatable Russian equivalent.

Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
4 years ago

@Moggie
@Grandfather

Oh, we’re talking about Anglo-Saxon Trial by Ordeal now? I love that.

The cake trial is so horrifying yet amusing. The whole idea that you have to eat a dry hunk of cake without water and if you die God has determined you were actually guilty seems to like it’s designed specifically to cause you to fail and die.

It also sounds so inoffensive and pleasant until you get right down to the specifics of the ordeal.

Another favorite of mine is the Trial by Hot Iron, where the accused holds a block of red-hot iron for a moment, and if their horrible, suppurating, leaking blisters become infected, you are guilty.

I believe that in the most extreme methods of exacting this punishment upon the accused you were actually supposed to sustain no damage to your fingers and palms whatsoever.

@All

Re: english

Consider the following:

Through tough thorough thought, though.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
4 years ago

@Fransesca : the worse ordeal to me is the one where people are bound and pushed into water. If they float, they are deemed witches and burned at the stack. If they drowned, they were innocents.

Like, WTF ? If you want to kill that poor sap that much, why not directly and painlessly kill him or her ?

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

It sort of makes me smile internally to imagine that in Russian they probably call the show “Doctor Which”

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ dashapants

The only relevant thing I can find from a Russian fan site is this;

Доктор Кто

But I’ll leave it to the experts as to whether that really gets the gist.

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ fran

The whole idea that you have to eat a dry hunk of cake without water

I know from a few pub bet attempts that you can’t eat three cream crackers.

dashapants
dashapants
4 years ago

@ Alan

So they did translate it literally. It does say Doctor Who. But that’s still a problem of how to translate that line in the context of the show, when it is used in dialogue. It doesn’t work as a legit question in Russian.

But oh well, Russian is very forgiving of making up semi-legit words by sticking on extra suffixes and prefixes and whatnot, and it’s pretty forgiving of weird sentence construction too, so it’s probably just used as is.

Though, really, Doctor Which would have been awesome.

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ dashapants

There used to be a kids’ show here called “Ask Aspel”. It was a thing where kids could write in and ask the presenter about stuff. His name was/is Michael Aspel, but apparently whenever kids met him they called him ‘Ask’.

Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
Francesca Torpedo, Femoid Special Forces Major
4 years ago

@Sir Alan

You’re a braver soul than I.
I get anxiety just eating a sandwich without a full glass of water or juice.

I don’t like eating at restaurants just because I don’t have full control over how much water or soda or juice I have at the ready. If my glass is empty I have to stop eating and wait for my drink to be freshened up.

Obviously, I’ll still eat a restaurant, it’s not crucial to me that my conditions be met, but I generally prefer my own home cooking for this reason.

Also, the thing I ordered from The Internet didn’t come today even though it was supposed to arrive in two days. I am extremely frustrated right now, even though it will probably arrive tomorrow.

Alan Robertshaw
4 years ago

@ fran

You’re a braver soul than I.

You spelled ‘dafter’ wrong.

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