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antifeminism gross incompetence memes misogyny MRA open thread

Correct Spelling is Misandry! A Memeday Open Thread

Stay in school, MRA kids!
Stay in school, MRA kids!

Dudes, seriously? If you’re this bad at spelling, run your damn memes by someone you know who can spell before posting them for all of the Internet to see.

The word is spelled "therefore."
Wat

Dudes: The word is spelled “therefore.” With an “e” at the end. Also, center your text properly! In addition, I would suggest that you 1) lay off the rape jokes and 2) try to make even a little bit of sense.

mraschoolthen

Dudes: it’s “than,” not “then.” They are different words, with different meanings, and you used the wrong one.

Also, that first sentence is a mess. Change “or have internalized misogyny” to “nor do they have internalized misogyny.”

Once again, a feminist has to do the work that MRAs should be doing themselves. At least this time they spelled “misogyny” correctly.

As for you, dear readers: Feel free to discuss the arguments (or the spelling) of any of these memes. But you can use this as an open thread, too.

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msexceptiontotherule
msexceptiontotherule
6 years ago

I’m slightly annoyed that the woman in the shark whatever it was supposed to be-meme has such a ridiculous expression…until I start to think that maybe these dudes see that expression from women ALL THE TIME because what they’re saying ALL THE TIME is that dumb. And of course dudes think it’s not that *they’re* always saying stupid stuff that doesn’t make sense, it’s that women don’t get their superior manly man way of thinking.

I’d be tempted to make that face around that bunch of dudes too, maybe followed with getting out the pepper spray.

EJ (The Other One)
6 years ago

I have done the otter’s quiz. I would be really interested, when all is done, to see the science behind the island survival question.

Kootiepatra
6 years ago

^ I agree with EJ (TOO). I am highly intrigued.

dust bunny
dust bunny
6 years ago

@ arash

Laziness by definition is “a disinclination to activity or exertion despite having the ability to act or exert oneself”
so when it’s easy and that person has the ability to spell check something, not prioritizing that thing is what we call laziness.

Laziness is a very value laden term, and calling people who don’t share your priorities lazy is not always justified. You can disagree with what people prioritize. For example, we disagree with “lazy” thinking that leads to stereotyping and prejudice, because we all agree that it’s so important to avoid hurting others it’s fair to say it should be a priority for everyone. But I can conceive of absolutely no good reason why good spelling would be as important. I can’t see what other reason there would be to value correct spelling highly at all, apart from the belief that it is bad to appear to have low intelligence, a learning disorder or a poor education. Maybe this is a failure of my imagination. I’m open to having my horizons broadened.

when there is no immediate way to know proper spelling it’s a disability but if you’re dyslexic and using the internet then you’re not disabled anymore because you can spell check anything quickly but you don’t.

I’m disabled. If I was able to completely hide my disability, with the use of tools or medication or whatever, and then heard people mock someone else for merely looking and sounding vaguely like they have my disability, I’d feel pretty awful.

it may have been used for this purpose, but invented?! you’re making a bold claim and you should back it up with evidence and reasoning.

I don’t think it requires either. We’re talking about an artificial barrier for participation that happened to fall along a class line. I’m not making literal claims about who first came up with the idea or why. Point is that we believe it today because it was a convenient excuse to discriminate against the disprivileged, and beliefs that serve that goal get propagated.

@ Kat

I don’t usually believe in belittling a person for bad spelling, but I’ll make an exception for these people.

Okay, but don’t you think there’s necessarily going to be some collateral belittling toward everyone who has trouble spelling?

arash
arash
6 years ago

if anybody is interested, here is another take on regressive left from a liberal point of view:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/10/30/not-muslim-enough-the-malcolm-x-zombie-rises-again.html

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
6 years ago

@arash

Go away.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

That shark attack meme makes no sense. Shark attacks are also less frequent than traffic jams and flu, so shut up and stop complaining and go live in the ocean? That’s their “solution”? The meme seems to be saying it would literally be easier for women to sprout gills and become marine creatures than for rapists to clean up their act. As if that’s such an outrageous idea. “Ha ha, decrease the behaviors and attitudes that lead to rape? You might as well flap your arms and fly to the moon!”

Re: spelling, maybe some of it is due to dyslexia/less privileged background, but I suspect a sizeable portion of it is due to MRAs dissing grammar and spelling as frivolous things that only nagging feminazi authority figures (teachers and moms) care about. From the way they talk about academia, I feel like it’s a value that many of them consciously reject. Spelling, like makeup and jewelry, is just a cosmetic nicety as far as they’re concerned. It’s beta and feminine to give too much of a shit about appearance. And it is true that an idea (or person) shouldn’t automatically get less consideration because of poor execution.

However, bad spelling and atrocious grammar completely undercuts their claim to be the more rational, intelligent sex. You just know that if they were critiquing something a woman had built, they’d be sneering at any sign that she didn’t take the utmost care with measurements, tools, and materials. Sloppy communication also doesn’t help win converts, but maybe PR isn’t the point of these.

@Imaginary Petal – took the Otter quiz. Looking forward to part 2!

Leda Atomica
Leda Atomica
6 years ago

Do shark attacks also happen less frequently than misandry? I wouldn’t suggest MRA types be put in sea though. Blah blah blah ecology blah blah blah polluting our oceans.

kupo
kupo
6 years ago

@Arash stop already with you regressive left bullshit.

Also, I didn’t want to get into it because I do think you’re at least mostly here to troll, but grammar being used as a tool of oppression is well documented. At best, it’s currently used to confirm bias. For example, a black person using poor grammar is assumed incompetent while a white person using poor grammar is given the benefit of the doubt. There are numerous local dialects of any language with their own grammar, but the “correct” grammar happens to be the one used by the ruling class, dating back to the dark ages when English grammar was defined using Latin.

Grammar is also sometimes used to try and force a language into rules that do not at all fit the language or culture, such as with Abbe de l’Épée, who believed deaf people were incapable of sophisticated thought because only a language as complex as written French could allow for sophisticated thought. He forced deaf children to learn to read and write in French and imposed French grammar rules on their hand signs, even though those rules don’t always work well in a visual, spacial language. Because if you can’t read and write proper French, clearly you’re incapable of sophisticated thought. And this concludes our lesson of the true history of the “father of sign language.”

Chiomara
Chiomara
6 years ago

On the “spelling” discussion:
I heavily disagree with people saying “people who can’t spell shouldn’t publicly speak” “bad spelling = laziness”. English is not my first language, I have (a low degree of) dyslexia and I am USELESS, at least in English, without my phone’s spellcheck. Still I have the right to communicate my thoughts. Hell, everyone does, even who can very barely read or write, and I will not ask them to spellcheck each word cause that’s absurd. The objective of language is to speak a message and be understood, and if that’s happening, then it’s right, and it’s quite, uh, ballsy and even desperate to consider a person dumb because of that or level of formal education. Not everyone has had the same opportunities in life, unfortunately.

Now, with that said, I have no problem with this post at all, because those texts are small (so it wouldn’t anyone to check it), go through many people before being posted, have really basic mistakes, but, most of all, because we all know that those guys are the first to try write pompously and laugh and undermine anyone who misspell. And it’s so delightful and justified to correct people who do this!

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
6 years ago

People know that picking on people’s spelling and grammatical abilities is a bit of a bugbear of mine. I won’t reiterate the points I’ve made before; I’m content that it’s been decided that it’s ok on this site.

But there are just two things I’d ask people to be wary of.

Firstly, assuming people fit a particularly ‘typical’ profile unless they prove otherwise. That belief that there’s some sort of ‘default normality’ can cause all sorts of problems. It’s why polite people ask about pronoun preferences rather than assuming.

Secondly, the ‘laziness’ thing. The “well I did it so anyone who can’t is just lazy” is used for everything from fat shaming to ATOS disability asssments.

It used to be the standard criticism of kids with educational needs. It’s the mindset behind the “What’s your excuse?” fitness campaign. It’s also the reason the government here has been able to remove disability benefits from hundreds of thousands of people. After all, if someone with the same disability as you can do a sponsored climb of Mount Kilamanjaro then you claiming you can’t work must just be down to laziness right?

If the memes claimed some sort of intellectual superiority then fine; that’s just pointing out irony and hypocrisy. But one privilege most people posting here seem to have is that they’re pretty smart. Making fun of people who aren’t as smart does seem like punching down.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

Bigotry always seems worse to me when it’s cloaked in flowery, perfectly spelled language (see: Heartiste).

That being said, there is a certain cognitive effort involved in decoding bad spelling, and it’s annoying when that effort is “rewarded” with douchespew telling you what a horrible person you are. Life is too short for that. I think we’d all rather spend time parsing thoughts that are sincere and worthwhile, however they’re expressed.

Rhuu
Rhuu
6 years ago

In the spirit of the open thread… Totally just tried to work up the courage to tell my incredibly religious sister that I’m probably gay? Didn’t happen. Nice phone conversation otherwise. :/ I’m really close to her and her family, there are just topics that we don’t discuss. I’m afraid to broach one, because that brings all the hate out.

I live far away from my family. I managed to tell my parents about ace-ness and liking the ladies (probably?) while I was visiting for Christmas, but it just never seemed to be the right time for my sister. I wanted to be able to do it when it would just be her and possibly her husband, because I didn’t want to deal with the kids. I wanted to have a car so I could escape right away, even though I realised later I could just walk over to the little strip mall and call either a cab or my parents.

I just wanted it to be done, so I didn’t have to worry about ‘what if’s anymore. We’ve already had the whole ‘love the sinner, hate the sin’ bullshit conversation, which I was angry about. Seriously, that is the worst crap…

I’m not involved with anyone, and I don’t know if I ever will be. I’d like to be. But I think one reason why it’s taken me so long (I’m in my early thirties) is because I didn’t want to deal with… Being different?

I know if I were to have a girlfriend, I would be really hesitant to bring them home. Which is awful, because I’m actually really close to my family, even the extremely Christian side of it. They’re a huge part of my life, and cutting them out would really hurt.

I’ve also been hesitant to even *go* home the past few years, knowing that I need to talk to this side of the family, knowing that I’ll face the rejection, and knowing that it’ll probably be the last time I’m going to feel comfortable going home.

Now the sister is coming to visit me. She’s going to be spending money to come out early, and we’re going to hang out. I need to tell her before they actually book things, because I don’t know if she’ll want to, or if I’ll want to. I need to talk to her.

It’s hard.

Top this all off with the fact that the doctor I wanted to get an appointment with isn’t currently accepting new patients because she’s moving practices. I have to find her new practice. I found out yesterday at work, after finally working up the courage to call. I didn’t realise how invested I was in this until it wasn’t going to happen.

It’s just a general check up, but I also need a tetanus booster and a few other things. I’ve needed to go to the doctor for a while, but I’m really shy about things. WHICH IS DUMB. I also want to take advantage of being currently covered under two insurances, but it doesn’t look like I moved fast enough to get the second one. It’s done in a week.

I was feeling so proud of myself that I actually called too… Gah.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
6 years ago

Firstly, assuming people fit a particularly ‘typical’ profile unless they prove otherwise. That belief that there’s some sort of ‘default normality’ can cause all sorts of problems.

I’m not assuming that they’re middle-class Anglophones because they’re people; I’m assuming that they’re middle-class Anglophones because they’re MRAs. I thought that would be obvious, since the number of MRAs who don’t fit that profile could be counted on one hand. They’re the most homogeneous group this side of the GOP.

And don’t talk about me instead of to me. I friggin’ hate that.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
6 years ago

@ IP

Done the survey; I’m intrigued!

The crash scenario is similar to something I’ve done before. But this time no-one is saying “Do you have any solutions that don’t involve eating the other survivors?” 🙂

guy
guy
6 years ago

Given just how readily available spellcheck is on the modern internet, and how I use it constantly (I’m not dyslexic but I misspelled “available” and my spellcheck caught it while writing) I feel it is reasonable to expect people to use it, but not to mock people for “rouge angles of satin” situations. Anything beyond automated spellcheck is more effort than it is reasonable for someone with dyslexia to apply to communication in the normal course of events. I have three browsers on my computer and all of them underline misspellings in red in this comment field.

Also, the complaining is not entirely born of a feeling of smug superiority. For me, reading a significant quantity of misspelled text is actively unpleasant. It’s like nails on a chalkboard. It’s been demonstrated that people can in general fnid the maineg of wrdos if all the letters are in there and the first and last are in the right place, but doing so is unpleasant.

arash
arash
6 years ago

@dust bunny
i take firm stand on my moral values but i don’t criticize anyone because they are different, i do it because they’re wrong (in my opinion obviously) and wrong and right happen to be different, this difference is a byproduct of how we define them and not the reason they’re called right and wrong.
so it has nothing to do with my agreement or disagreement, it’s not a matter of taste, i can agree with someone that a music is enjoyable but i won’t make a moral judgment about people who like it or not.
also it should be noted that if something is popular it doesn’t mean it’s right, everybody would disagree with and you still can be right so let’s avoid argumentum ad populum.

your other argument is that lazy is used unfairly and inappropriately, well which word isn’t! this word has not lost the meaning that i used and actually this definition is the accepted one, so just because some assholes label disabled people as “lazy” doesn’t mean we shouldn’t use it to describe healthy people that fit this definition

I’m disabled. If I was able to completely hide my disability, with the use of tools or medication or whatever, and then heard people mock someone else for merely looking and sounding vaguely like they have my disability, I’d feel pretty awful.

unlike a word like fag which is used to describe gay people and also insult others by comparing them to gay people, lazy is primarily used to describe healthy people without referring to any disabled person it’s an insult in itself without any comparison and when used against people like you it’s rather because of not acknowledging your disability.

I don’t think it requires either. We’re talking about an artificial barrier for participation that happened to fall along a class line. I’m not making literal claims about who first came up with the idea or why. Point is that we believe it today because it was a convenient excuse to discriminate against the disprivileged, and beliefs that serve that goal get propagated.

i’m not talking about “who” but “how”, because there are other alternative explanation for “how” it happened so if a class uses it, doesn’t mean it was invented by that class unless you prove your explanation with better reasoning and evidence.

zoon echon logon
zoon echon logon
6 years ago

I’m hopeless at arithmetic. If I add something up wrong, it’s still wrong. Syntax is inherently normative.

Leda Atomica
Leda Atomica
6 years ago

@ Rhuu

I just wanted it to be done, so I didn’t have to worry about ‘what if’s anymore. We’ve already had the whole ‘love the sinner, hate the sin’ bullshit conversation, which I was angry about. Seriously, that is the worst crap…

First of all, sorry you’re going through this. Second, I hate that “hate the sin” crap too. Mostly because I’ve grown disillusioned to the notion of ‘sin’, as a man-made concept of random “I’m better than you because…”. It’s not even a real thing! Anything can be a ‘sin’ and it’s made out as if it’s valid because *reasons*.

I hate that the fact of who you are has become a distressing factor within your family, and even though you may live far away or feel distant, they’re still in the back of your head as a family. The people who are supposed to care no matter what.

I’ve no idea about the point of my post but just wanted to offer you a big furry internet paw of support, in case you feel like it.

kupo
kupo
6 years ago

Does anyone find it ironic that Arash is justifying their grammar mocking while using terrible grammar?

Arash, there actually isn’t a right or wrong in grammar. Prescriptive grammar is recognized as flawed and linguists have moved on to descriptive. Language is fluid, and rules are redefined regularly. Your premise is faulty.

Brony, Social Justice Cenobite

I asked David in an email if it was OK if I asked some questions about a potential website about social conflict techniques, but I guess they are busy. Given the subject I still feel that I should ask, would anyone mind if I asked some questions having to do with this and surrounding context? I would start by answering EJ’s comment to me.
https://www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/2016/02/11/dude-is-mad-homophobic-slur-and-ethnic-slur-think-his-trump-shirt-promotes-hate/comment-page-10/#comment-680891
https://www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/2016/02/11/dude-is-mad-homophobic-slur-and-ethnic-slur-think-his-trump-shirt-promotes-hate/comment-page-10/#comment-679975

arash
arash
6 years ago

@SFHC

@arash
Go away.

you are convinced that you can change my mind, interesting.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

For me, reading a significant quantity of misspelled text is actively unpleasant. It’s like nails on a chalkboard. It’s been demonstrated that people can in general fnid the maineg of wrdos if all the letters are in there and the first and last are in the right place, but doing so is unpleasant.

Exactly. Just as spelling is an effort for some people, reading is an effort for others.

I can happily skip over typos, spelling and grammar if the content is interesting, but with memes like these, I become very aware of the processing costs involved, and resentful of the precious seconds of my life I just wasted trying to work out what it is they’re saying. It’s like solving a Sunday Times crossword clue, only the answer turns out to be “go jump in the ocean, you hypergamous slut”.

Leda Atomica
Leda Atomica
6 years ago

I’m not taking part in the spelling conversation as such, because the commenters here have lived up to my expectations of brilliantly put arguments.

It’s just that… how many times can you read “moslems” in a racist argument? You can’t even spell-check the people you hate with vigour!

guy
guy
6 years ago

Maybe this is because I am in computer science and our grammars are absolutely prescriptive, but I am not really altogether happy with saying that linguistic grammar is descriptive and we should not care about its use. There is no objectively correct standard of grammar, but using a consistent one reduces ambiguity.

Sure, in practical cases the meaning is usually clear, but the extreme is flipping subject and object with no clear indication, and I think we can all agree that would be a problem.

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