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antifeminism misandry misogyny MRA paul elam threats violence against men/women

Men’s Rights site A Voice for Men offers $1000 “bounty” for personal information on Swedish feminists

A Voice for Men, one of the most influential and popular Men’s Rights websites, is now offering a $1000 “bounty” for anyone able to track down the personal information of several Swedish women involved in a tasteless video advertising a theater production based on Valarie Solanas’ SCUM manifesto. As the anonymous poster calling himself John the Other – the second-in-command at AVfM – put it in a posting yesterday (emphasis in original):

We are asking for the full legal names, home addresses, places of employment, email addresses and contact phone numbers of the women and man who produced and starred in the video described above. We will pay 1000 dollars to any individual who provides and confirms this information, to be paid either directly to themselves or to a charity of their choice.

John explains that this information will be posted on the AVfM-affiliated site Register-Her.com, an “offenders database” that is being used to vilify individual feminists and “Fuck Their Shit Up,” as AVfM head honcho Paul Elam likes to put it. John notes that Regsiter-Her.com also intends to post the “government identification numbers [and] drivers licences” of the women they are able to identify.

John admits plainly that posting such information may put the physical safety of these women at risk from vigilante violence. As he puts it (emphasis mine):

Some individuals may criticize the intent to publish not only names, but also addresses, phone numbers, employers and other personal information – on the grounds that such exposure create a risk of retributive violence against individuals who openly advocate murder based on sex. It is the considered position of the editorial board of AVfM that any such risks are out-weighed by the ongoing hazard to the public of these individuals continuing to operate in anonymity.

The comments posted on the article at AVfM suggest that such “retributive” violence is a real possibility. Indeed, here’s the very first comment (which currently has 17 upvotes from readers of the site):

A commenter called  Xnomolos, in another upvoted comment, adds:

i would love to hunt down these women myself.

JinnBottle responds to this comment by advising “all men to start carrying guns.”

The commenters on AVfM have already uncovered the identities of all of the women involved in the video. The blogger Fidelbogen has been the most active internet detective so far.

There is no question that the video itself is offensive, and designed to provoke. You can see it here; I’m not going to embed it on this site. If you don’t want to watch it: it depicts a young woman shooting a man in the head for no reason. Afterwards the woman and her gleeful, giggling accomplices do a victory dance, then lick the blood from the dead man’s head. A message at the end urges viewers to “Do Your Part.”

Every feminist I know who has seen the video has been appalled by it. I’m appalled by it. It’s hateful, and it’s wrong.

But John the Other, and the other commenters on AVfM, claim that it is more than this: that that the video of the staged murder, intended to provide publicity for a theater production based on Solanas’ notorious SCUM manifesto, is quite literally an open call for the murder of men. As John the Other puts it:

Open advocation of murder cannot be allowed in a civil society, without that society devolving into a culture of brutal violence.

Evidently he has no problem with, or has somehow not noticed, the comments on AVfM fantasizing about shooting and killing the women involved in the video.

Is the video a literal call to murder? Is it, as one AVfM commenter puts it, evidence of a “conspiracy to commit mass murder?” No. Violence and murder have been dramatized in the theater since its beginnings. No one accuses Sophocles of advocating fratricide and incest, though both are dealt with in his play Oedipus Rex. No one accuses Shakespeare of advocating mass murder, though many of his most famous plays have body counts that put many horror films to shame.

Does the tag line at the end of the video – “do your part” – transform the video from a depiction of murder  into an open call for it? No. The “threat,” such as it is, is vague; it’s not aimed at any specific individuals. It might be seen as akin to someone wearing a t-shirt that says “kill ‘em all, let God sort them out” – tasteless and offensive, but not a literal threat.  “Kill ‘Em All” is actually the name of Metallica’s first album. While a lot of people see James Hetfield,  Lars Ulrich et al as pompous idiots, they have not been jailed for conspiracy to commit mass murder. That would be ridiculous.

Someone claiming to have been involved in the SCUM-inspired theatrical production in question has posted several detailed comments on AVfM, explaining that those involved in the production are “not out to get you” and that the video itself was “meant as a viral “wtf?!” to give attention to both the questions that it raises and the play itself.”

By contrast, AVfM is targeting specific individuals, and intends to offer information that would allow anyone intent on doing them harm to quite literally track them to their homes and workplaces. Those fantasizing about killing these woman are not simply making a joke along the lines of “women, can’t live with ‘em; can’t kill ‘em.” They are fantasizing about killing real people, and providing would-be evil-doers maps to their doors.

AVfM is an American site, in English; these specific women live in Sweden. While it is a real possibility, it seems unlikely that anyone reading the site will literally find and murder any of those involved in the SCUM production. At least I hope that this does not come to pass.

I don’t believe that either Paul Elam or John the Other literally wants any feminist to be killed. The real intent behind AVfM’s publishing people’s personal information, it seems clear, is to intimidate feminist writers and activists into shutting up, to make clear that if they post something that offends the internet vigilantes at AVfM they will face the possibility of some deranged individual quite literally showing up at their door intent on doing them harm.

Paul Elam and John the Other claim that they’re not advocating violence. But they are playing a dangerous game here. If some deranged individual, inspired by the hyperbolic anti-feminist rhetoric on AVfM, and armed with information provided by “Register-Her.com,” murders or otherwise harms a feminist blogger or activist or video maker, Elam and his enablers will have blood on their hands. As will those MRAs who continue to publicly support and/or link to AVfM and/or Register-Her.com.

This is not the way a legitimate rights group deals with those who disagree with them. This is what hate groups do.

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CassandraSays
CassandraSays
10 years ago

Personally I’m still appalled that people think that Pearl Harbor justified Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Either these people have never seen any photos of what happens when you drop atomic weapons on people, or they’re using the same sort of logic that leads MRAs to claim that punching your wife in the face is a reasonable and proportionate response to her nagging you about taking out the trash.

Well, that logic plus racism.

Amused
Amused
10 years ago

No, how they can deny it when they have the NAZI’s own records (and I find I have to admire how meticulous they were about documenting their own crimes, it made things so much easier when they came to trial) to say nothing of eyewitnesses, photos and newsreels beats me.

Or, you know, the fact that the Nazi criminals never denied it at their trials. At Nuremberg, defendants presented all kinds of defenses: they were just following orders, they exterminated people quickly and humanely, they sat in their office with blinds drawn and didn’t have ANY idea this was happening, they thought that smell was just their thousands of neighbors all making roast every day for 5 years, the Jews and Gypsies deserved it, etc. But not one of them disputed the fact of the Holocaust itself. You’d think if the Holocaust was just an invention, they would all be like, “Dude. What the hell are you talking about? What death camps? Auschwitz was just a working-class resort with spas and comfortable apartments!”

SaruGoku
SaruGoku
10 years ago

Amused:

One would think so. Yes, they did confess at The Nurenburg Trials but there are still plenty of deniers who claim they were “kangaroo courts” and in spite of all the evidence to the contrary that the holocaust never happened and that it was all a conspiracy.

SaruGoku
SaruGoku
10 years ago

CassandraSays:

I agree with you. I find it difficult to get my head around that sort of death and distraction, to say nothing of the aftermath and to say that it was in some way just retribution for the attack on Pearl Harbour is mind boggling.

When I was in my teens I asked my nuclear chemist father what happened to people during a nuclear attack who were close to ground zero, who got caught in the firestorm or the fallout and what radiation sickness was like the answers he gave me (he was very honest, very blunt and he really wanted me to understand) gave me nightmares for months. So did the books he gave me to read on the subject. I remember a photograph in one of the books of the “shadow” left by a person who had been vaporized in the blast at Hiroshima and it haunts me to this day.

Renjo
Renjo
10 years ago

@Rutee Katreya:
“Follow along, idiot:”

Excuse me?

Okay, was that even freaking necessary? I asked a question concerning whether what Holly said was a bit hypocritical considering everyone else does it.

Isn’t it disrespectful to call someone an idiot when they said nothing offensive? That’s not going to help someone follow along, and would almost prove the MRA right on how disrespectful people like you can be. I’d like to think otherwise, but you’re the only one who seems to be like that.

Ben Fenton
10 years ago

“Do your part” is not a call for violence, it’s a quote from the SCUM Manifesto, and part of the play.

Keiran
Keiran
10 years ago

I disagree with the author of this article. The women in that video represent a very real attitude toward men and boys and depicting the murder of men simply because they are men only helps desensitise the public. The SCUM manifesto was written by an extremely violent woman who tried to Murder Andy Worhol. She shot him, but he managed to survive the attack. He lived the rest of his life in fear after this.

Feminists themselves would be in UPROAR if a video was made depicting violence against women in the same way as this video has shown violence against men. Feminists also say media portrayal of women shapes how society views them in general. So, the fact is men have been discriminated against for too long and made to look fools as well. If we allow women like those in the video to continue dehumanising men, then one day it might be entirely possible that women will be shooting men and getting away with it. Indeed women have murdered men, attacked men and mutilated men only to be given awards by politicians and gain support from the public. Enough is enough. The women in this video should be named and shamed, publishing the details online should serve as a warning to other women to NOT behave in a similar way. Personally i wish to see these women lose their jobs and be spoken to by the Police regarding this gender based violence they are promoting. What they have done would be considered a crime (by law) if women were the victims instead. I do see these women as criminals, as being dangerous and therefore have no place in civil society.

Outlawing violence against women, whilst depicting violence against men as a joke is NOT acceptable under any circumstances.

It is highly unlikely these womens personal safety is endangered. Only a lunatic or a psychopath would consider harming another person. But the aim of publishing their names and details is to shame and frighten them from behaving in a similar way again. Men must fight attitudes like this where violence against them is ok. Feminism started this war, so when ever women behave like animals and promote violence against men we must react and react stongly. Men have lost too many freedoms, too many rights and too many dignities. Its now time to defend ourselves.

Peter M.
Peter M.
10 years ago

The video quoted is clearly designed to incite violence against men, and to diminish the seriousness of violence against men, on the grounds that men deserve violent treatment because they are men.

This is unsurprising: We live in a matriarchy. Women control 89% of all consumer spending, which itself accounts for 74% of the total economy (Source: Proctor and Gamble, US Treasury). This is despite the fact that men are granted 94.4% of all patents (Source: US Patent Office), are the victims of 96% of all workplace deaths (Source: OSHA), and work on average 35% longer hours in paid work (US Household Survey – Occupational Tasks). Men are therefore disproportionately responsible for the generation of wealth, while women control and dispose of that wealth.

Men unfit for wealth-generation are disposed of by being made homeless (men 6x more likely to become homeless), ill or sick (men massively more likely to suffer from ‘lifestyle’ diseases, PTSD, stress-related mental illnesses and depression) or, in admittedly extreme cases, driven to suicide.

Of marriages which end in divorce, in 75% of cases it is the woman who has sought the divorce. When a woman is placed in a position where the disposal of a man will leave her no worse, or even more favoured, financially (i.e. 5+ years of marriage, when one or more properties are jointly owned, savings/equity total >$250k), the chances that she will seek a divorce are 14x greater than average (Source: University of Chicago GSB). This leaves her free to seek a new partner for novelty/further reproductive endeavor, or to increase opportunity for social advancement through community engagement (in >90% of cases mothers granted residency of children).

By comparison, a European survey conducted of 24,000 MARRIED women who had received a diagnosis of a life-limiting disease (Huntingdon’s Chorea, Parkinsons, early-onset Alzheimers etc.) found just 124 had separated or divorced their partners, just 16 of whom stated that this was at their instigation (i.e. the divorce rate for 24,000 randomly-selected married women should be around 34% – after ten years – but when the women realise they will require a long-term care-giver, this drops to 0.51%) – Source: EUSHID 2004.

Lie
Lie
10 years ago

“This is not the way a legitimate rights group deals with those who disagree with them. This is what hate groups do.”

The Black Panther Party.

The New Black Panther Party (want vigilante Justice for Trayvons death)

Malcolm X

Nelson Mandela http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKiePbTcAfY&feature=related

Pussy Riot

Funny you never mention any of this (nor does the establishment).

What a load of crock.

Jonatan
Jonatan
5 years ago

First of all, a manginist (a male feminist) is not in the position to go writing off anti-feminist or masculinist moves as this or that… you should ZIP UP YOUR BLOODY BUTT and keep a low profile in front of us, anti-Feminists or masculinists.

I don’t fucking care whether your Femishit friends are apalled or not, the problem is that flipping FEM which bubbled up years ago… when it actually shouldn’t have ever existed.

Feminism is the problem and that’s it. And you calling yourselves Feminists worsen even more these situations.
Is the video a literal call to murder? Is it, as one AVfM commenter puts it, evidence of a “conspiracy to commit mass murder?”]

“DO YOUR PART”, FUCKING WASTE OF MANGINIST FLESH… does that sound like anything to your empty skull?

Idiot.

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