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MRA post of the day: “There’s no such thing as tOXic masculinity you dumb c___.”

Well, you’ve got to admit that he gets right to the point.

I examined some of his posting history on Reddit, and determined that 1) he’s not a troll, just a huge jerk, and 2) he does indeed love big boobs.

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Mrs. Obed Marsh
Mrs. Obed Marsh
3 months ago

Ah, I love it when MRAs forget how adjectives work.

Lizzie
Lizzie
3 months ago

I don’t know, I think the Men’s Rosary Group are a pretty good illustration of toxic masculinity in action. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jan/18/ashling-murphy-ireland-misogyny-attack-violence

CanuckAmuck
CanuckAmuck
3 months ago

Welp, he convinced me! Glad that’s settled. What else we got on the plate?

Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
3 months ago

okay, that made me laugh. “there’s no such thing as tigers!” screamed the tiger.

Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
3 months ago

He loves big boobs but hates the women who have them. Hatred isn’t toxic. And random capitalization will remain forever cool.

I’m ready for the quiz on this guy.

ETA: Elaine The Witch, you made me laugh.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
3 months ago

@ Elaine

I’ll see your tyger and raise you Sparks.

Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
3 months ago

@kat

You can tell the covid is healing because the sense of humor is coming back

Gerrysherry
Gerrysherry
3 months ago

MRAs: “no matter how much you repeat ‘trans women are women’ will never make it true”
Also MRAs: “Toxic masculinity isn’t real! Toxic masculinity is real! Toxic masculinity isn’t real!”

Acid Kritana
3 months ago

This dude just happens to be a jerk, and while in general I do not believe in toxic masculinity, I will say it’s real if y’all say toxic femininity (of the same kind) is real. Otherwise, I will continue to say toxic masculinity isn’t real.

Maria Garcia
Maria Garcia
3 months ago

Rather provoking article. Made me think. I read about this product before on COMPACOM but know I have doubts whether they were right. Both articles describe similar things but in diametrically different ways. Check it out yourself and decide which one to trust.

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
3 months ago

@Acid: I don’t particularly care whether you think or say toxic masculinity is real or not. However, I am curious what you think toxic masculinity actually is. Because like many terms used in progressive spaces, it’s often very misrepresented.

Makroth
Makroth
3 months ago

@Acid Kritana

Please define both terms.

Malintzin
Malintzin
3 months ago

I like big boobs and I cannot lie? (That’s pretty frivolous, sorry). About toxic femininity and masculinity, Ummm……..well, if you are wasting your time hurting other people with rude, unkind, superior, narcissistic attitudes in the name of some sort of traditional idea of male or female … that’s my definition of both.

Acid Kritana
3 months ago

If toxic masculinity were real (as were toxic femininity), then I would describe them as the follow:

Toxic masculinity: When a man (gay/straight, trans/cis, etc.) acts overly masculine, causing harm to his mentality, or decides to hurt other men (physically, emotionally, mentally, etc.) to put them into place/so they don’t deviate (gay, feminine, not marrying a woman, marrying a man, etc.), or otherwise change their behavior. Or kill another man for what they are (gay, trans, atheist, etc.).

Toxic femininity: When a woman (gay/lesbian/straight, trans/cis, etc.) acts overly feminine, causing harm to her mentality, or decides to hurt another woman (physically, emotionally, mentally, etc.) or slut shame them. Attack another woman/girl, or punish her for trying to go after her man/woman/person, or just for not fitting in. Or hit a man/her boyfriend/her husband. Or hit a woman/her girlfriend/her wife. Or hit a person/her dating partner/her spouse. Or to think that she’s better than other women (queen bee syndrome), while thinking that women are better than men (women-are-wonderful effect).

That would be my definition.

Surplus to Requirements
Surplus to Requirements
3 months ago

Well, I finally got my jab-three. In terrible weather. Return taxi arrived after over half an hour with a passenger already inside, for some reason, refused to take on another, and then moved on again, and I had to summon another, which fortunately didn’t take nearly as long and arrived in the normal empty and ready to be used condition. (Their response time in that part of town has always been terrible, mind you.)

Hoping none of that excessive time spent waiting got me infected.

Site is still acting wonky: form autocomplete not working as well as it used to, pages sometimes coming up as outdated versions tens of minutes old, etc.

When is David planning to restore it fully to normal again? I didn’t catch that part.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
3 months ago

@ acid kitrana

Whilst I would generally agree with your definition of toxic masculinity; or at least accept your examples as representative of the phenomenon, I think there’s a problem with your definition of toxic femininity.

Basically, the masculinity examples do tally with traditional views on what it means to be a man. Overtly competitive, physically strong, ability to suppress emotions etc.

But the examples you give for toxic femininity don’t correspond with how society generally views feminine stereotypes. Quite the opposite. If there is a cliched view of what it is to be feminine then the examples you give are quite contrary to that.

For example, a woman using violence against a man, or indeed anybody, would probably be seen as deviant, rather than conforming to an ideal.

Women are expected to be non violent, and caring, and supportive.

The examples you give are very much inconsistent with that.

I should perhaps add that ‘toxic femininity’ is a term used by womanist writers. There it describes what we might now call ‘Karen’ behaviour.

It’s that weaponisation of supposed female vulnerability.

And you can find examples of that from Emmet Till to that poor chap who was just bird watching in the park.

And apologies if I’m misinterpreting your stance; but I don’t think that’s what you were suggesting.

Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
3 months ago

Acid you should sign up for the Marines. As a trans boy I’m sure you’ll learn all about toxic masculinity which you will somehow blame on women like you always do.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
3 months ago

@ Elaine

you should sign up for the Marines

There’s a thing here, especially with army types, where if anyone says they’re in the Marines you have to say “Ooh, what instrument do you play?”

I did that once and the guy replied “Cornet” and proceeded to give me a full history of the regimental band. It was really interesting.

GSS ex-noob
GSS ex-noob
3 months ago

Self-pwning is so common with these sorts, isn’t it?

@Alan: Karen-ing is more tied up with White privilege than even toxic masculinity is. Plenty of toxic PoC men, but they aren’t calling the cops on birdwatchers.

The White women of a certain age I know are really careful not to give the appearance of being a Karen. Last time I asked for a manager, it was because I’d been standing in a line to get a much-needed medicine, and they’d told me “20 minutes” 40 minutes before, when they said “20 minutes” again. Being as it was for pain, and I was standing outside on concrete at sundown in winter, I *really* felt I needed to get my meds and go home to collapse on the couch. (Said manager was also a White woman, so I didn’t feel I was oppressing anyone. And I thanked her profusely.)

Toxic femininity, if it exists, is usually rooted in the general patriarchal-ness of society; women are encouraged to be that way because they sometimes have no other recourse in a male-dominated society. They’ve often been programmed into it.

It kills far fewer people, though that’s no comfort to those who’ve suffered from it, like Emmett Till’s family. Incel women are much less likely to start shooting up a public place.

Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
3 months ago

@ Alan
It’s some joke that Marines know and my husband tried to explain to me but I don’t know what it is.

.45
.45
3 months ago

@ Acid Kritana

You don’t believe in toxic masculinity, as you give a great definition of same? Seriously? You can identify these guys from the bumper stickers on their trucks. Manly man types who brag about what animals they’ve shot, how many fights they’ve been in, the women they’ve banged, etc, etc. Best not to be too rude to them, even though they are assholes to everyone else, or you end up in a fight.

@ Surplus to Requirements

It doesn’t seem like anyone else is having problems.

Anyway, as for Marines, the jokes I always heard revolved around Windex and Crayons.

epitome of incomprehensibility

@Alan Robertshaw – Yes, I agree about women being expected to be “non violent, and caring, and supportive” but in my experience this can also be used as an excuse to get away with violent behaviour. Because it’s less expected.

@Acid Kritana – But it’s still gender stereotypes that are the problem, aren’t they? Still the patriarchal idea that men are expected to do all the action stuff and women the passive stuff (as in the weird sperm theory in the next post).

It seems to me you’re interpreting “toxic masculinity” as “men do bad things” and countering with “women do bad things too.” No one would deny that the second part is true. I don’t think any gender is better than another. But that line of argument seems to be missing the point. As far as I can tell, the idea of toxic masculinity is that certain VIEWS of what it means to masculine are harmful, and they lead to harmful behaviour.

(Let me know if that makes sense, and, anyone, feel free to correct anything I’m wrong or unclear about.)

Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
Kat, ambassador, feminist revolution (in exile)
3 months ago

@Acid Kritana

“[I]n general I do not believe in toxic masculinity, I will say it’s real if y’all say toxic femininity (of the same kind) is real. Otherwise, I will continue to say toxic masculinity isn’t real.”

The reality of one thing doesn’t make the reality of another thing any more — or less — real.

********************

“If toxic masculinity were real (as were toxic femininity), then I would describe them as the follow:

“Toxic masculinity: When a man (gay/straight, trans/cis, etc.) acts overly masculine, causing harm to his mentality, or decides to hurt other men (physically, emotionally, mentally, etc.) to put them into place/so they don’t deviate (gay, feminine, not marrying a woman, marrying a man, etc.), or otherwise change their behavior. Or kill another man for what they are (gay, trans, atheist, etc.).”

So toxic masculinity is about hurting other men.

***********************

“Toxic femininity: When a woman (gay/lesbian/straight, trans/cis, etc.) acts overly feminine, causing harm to her mentality, or decides to hurt another woman (physically, emotionally, mentally, etc.) or slut shame them. Attack another woman/girl, or punish her for trying to go after her man/woman/person, or just for not fitting in. Or hit a man/her boyfriend/her husband. Or hit a woman/her girlfriend/her wife. Or hit a person/her dating partner/her spouse. Or to think that she’s better than other women (queen bee syndrome), while thinking that women are better than men (women-are-wonderful effect).”

And toxic femininity is about hurting other women — or men, including hitting them. I refer you back to your original post:

“[I]n general I do not believe in toxic masculinity, I will say it’s real if y’all say toxic femininity (OF THE SAME KIND) is real. [My all caps.]”

Trolls never care about consistency.

TacticalProgressive
TacticalProgressive
3 months ago

@Acid Kritana Ian Danskin of Innuendo Studios described toxic masculinity as a myopic, narrowly defined masculinity to the point of malignancy that only acknowledges and enforces the notion that the only valid form of masculinity is the most extreme to the point of self harming. Not only does Toxic Masculinity exist: I, as a straight, cis, het, white man: have seen it in action and have been a victim of it and those who champion it; because I’m both someone who not only doesn’t meet Toxic Masculities chauvinist, narrow and toxic paradigm; I oppose it and deconstruct it and see it as a bs rat race of a myopic social script that is as harmful to men as it does women (though it hurts women more).

The term “Toxic Femininity” frankly was a term that was nebulous and undefined and to put it bluntly; was a term made up by Misogynists, MRA’s, Incels and MGTOW’s and anti-feminists as a corrupted snarl word stolen and contorted form progressive feminist rhetoric the same way that “white power” movements stole and warped rhetoric and canards from the Black Power movements of the civil rights era.

For the sake of argument though, even if “Toxic Femininity” were a thing that may exist in good faith: it would hypothetically basically fall under the same general rubric of Toxic Masculinity (I.E. a myopic, narrowly defined Femininity to the point of malignancy that only acknowledges and enforces the notion that the only valid form of Femininity is the most extreme to the point of self harming), baring the fact that it was a rubric crafted and enforced by Patriarchy and in turn Toxic Masculinity in the first place to further enforce Toxic Masculine Patriarchy, which seeks to keep all women in a position of subservience and stripping and denial of women’s empowerment.

And more over, I have a more pertinent question even under that auspice: even if supposed “Toxic Femininity” did exist in good faith alongside Toxic Masculinity; which of the two is responsible for high degrees of domestic violence, suicide and outright violence and terrorist acts. Because real talk, even IF “Toxic Femininity” were a think in good faith that existed and having some admittedly considerable problems; it’s not the one that would be engaging in stochastic terrorism and actual terrorism and shootings or advocating that women be slaves or die for not conforming to an arbitrary social script that favors men.

That would be Toxic Masculinity at work.

That, would be toxic masculinity

Elaine The Witch
Elaine The Witch
3 months ago

.45
You forgot the most common form of toxic masculinity which is not going to therapy because having feelings is for a pussy. Much more manly to just off yourself instead. The Marines and other military branches call mental health services “going to see the Wizard” because there is this idea it doesn’t actually do anything. And guess who has highest numbers for taking their own lives? Military members. A mostly male dominated field with high numbers of toxic masculinity.

But no toxic masculinity doesn’t exists because little boy mras like acid says so. Why don’t you take a shit on service members who killed themselves since your already pissing on their graves with that shit acid. God you fuckers make me so mad.

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