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antifeminism chivalry citation needed dude you've got no fucking idea what you're talking about matriarchy rape culture scott adams

Scott Adams: We live in a matriarchy because men have to get permission for sex

Matriarchy in action?
Matriarchy in action?

The Paris attacks have inspired cartoonist and opinion-haver Scott Adams to reflect on some of the true injustices in the world today.

Specifically, the fact that in the United States, men often pay for dates, yet cannot have sex with women without getting their permission first.

In a blog post that is incoherent even by his standards, Adams compares the male-dominated societies of the Middle East with what he describes as “female-dominated countries” like the US.

In his mind, American men live in a matriarchal dystopia in which women force men to pay for dinner and open car doors for them:

When I go to dinner, I expect the server to take my date’s order first. I expect the server to deliver her meal first. I expect to pay the check. I expect to be the designated driver, or at least manage the transportation for the evening. And on the way out, I will hold the door for her, then open the door to the car.

Weird, because I’ve literally never had a date like that. And even if all this were true, as a general thing, it wouldn’t be proof that the US is “female-dominated.” Chivalry is part of patriarchy, not proof of matriarchy.

When we get home, access to sex is strictly controlled by the woman.

Er, dude, that’s how sex works. Both sex partners have to agree to it, otherwise it’s rape. And men have veto power when it comes to sex just like women do. Women aren’t allowed to force themselves on unwilling partners any more than men are.

If the woman has additional preferences in terms of temperature, beverages, and whatnot, the man generally complies. If I fall in love and want to propose, I am expected to do so on my knees, to set the tone for the rest of the marriage.

What a romantic fellow, proposing to a woman even though she’s some kind of spoiled princess who has preferences about room temperature and refuses to have sex when she doesn’t want to have sex.

Also, Adams wants everyone to know that when he talks over women in meetings, it’s not that he’s a sexist, it’s just that women talk too much.

Women have made an issue of the fact that men talk over women in meetings. In my experience, that’s true. But for full context, I interrupt anyone who talks too long without adding enough value. If most of my victims turn out to be women, I am still assumed to be the problem in this situation, not the talkers.

But really, the problem is that ladies just won’t shut up amirite fellas high five!

The alternative interpretation of the situation – that women are more verbal than men – is never discussed as a contributing factor to interruptions. Can you imagine a situation where – on average – the people who talk the most do NOT get interrupted the most?

Uh, yes. Because that’s not just a hypothetical “situation.” It’s the way the world actually works.

I don’t know if the amount of talking each person does is related to the amount of interrupting they experience, or if there is a gender difference to it, but it seems like a reasonable hypothesis. 

Unfortunately for Adams, this is a hypothesis that’s been repeatedly disproved. Men talk more than women in meetings, yet are more likely to interrupt women than women are to interrupt them.

Weird how Adams, who thinks of himself as a rational sciencey guy, didn’t even bother to do the 30 seconds of Googling that would have shown that his “reasonable hypothesis” was a crock.

Speaking of weirdness, Adams goes on to suggest that he might turn to terrorism if no one gives him a hug. Literally.

So if you are wondering how men become cold-blooded killers, it isn’t religion that is doing it. If you put me in that situation, I can say with confidence I would sign up for suicide bomb duty. And I’m not even a believer. Men like hugging better than they like killing. But if you take away my access to hugging, I will probably start killing, just to feel something. I’m designed that way. I’m a normal boy. And I make no apology for it.

NOTE TO SELF: Do not invite Scott Adams to any party without also inviting this dude:

Capturefreehugs

Or maybe don’t invite Adams to any parties at all.

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dhag85
dhag85
6 years ago

I’m curious to know how common these types of dates are. Do some people actually date like this? With the weird chivalry and everything? You Mammotheers who are actually dating, or have dated in the past, is this a real thing?

I’ve never really “dated” in that sense. For me it’s always been the case that you talk to someone at work, at school, online, at a coffee shop, at a bar, etc, and eventually you realize you like each other. The only money changing hands in a dating situation that I’ve experienced was when I was a teenager and I had to go on the bus in order to meet up with the girl I was seeing, and she voluntarily paid for my return bus ticket each time.

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
6 years ago

Another illustration that an author can do not-horrible things but have horrible view.

(by not-horrible I mean that dilbert isn’t a piece of MRA propaganda ; I still like it quite a bit even if the start was much better ; not that Dilbert is a masterpiece of humor)

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
6 years ago

@Dhag & Walter

Well, it’s admittedly hard to break through his misogynist-standard purple prose, but I just can’t see any reason for him to complain about (or even bring up) rape being illegal unless it’s followed up with an unstated “It’s not fair!!! It should be legal!!!” hiding somewhere between the lines. I dunno, I might be being too harsh on him, but it’s hard to tell when he writes like fucking Fidelbogen. =P

Either way, I’m going to go wash the taste of Dickbert’s bullshit out of my brain using methods that have nothing at all to do with “Getting stoned and watching How To Train Your Dragon.”

darkstatistic
darkstatistic
6 years ago

“Access to sex”.

This is where the whole problem lies. (For the following rant, I’m assuming cishet relationships — I acknowledge this is not always the case, but for expediency, I’m running with it.)

You do not “access” sex. Sex is not a location. It is not a body part. Depending on the type of sex you’re interested in, you might need access to various parts or places of your partner’s body. “Sex” however, is a verb in this context.

So what he’s actually saying here is “access to the vagina is strictly controlled by the woman”. Other people have pointed this out as being a horrifying thing to object to. But it’s worth noting that the assumption is still that sex is something you “get” from women or a part of a woman’s body you access.

That’s the real, actual problem in my opinion. Yes, of course women should be controlling access to their various body parts, but those body parts are not sex in the first place. That’s much much worse than the implication that women ought not have that control, because it’s the root of that implication among many others. This is where you get the notions of “pussy inflation” and “redistribution of sex” and these other nightmares that spring from redpill sites. That’s the head of the snake, so to speak.

dhag85
dhag85
6 years ago

@SFHC

I agree it’s a terrible article. My take is that he does say “it’s not fair!”, but instead of “it should be legal!” he goes to “boo hoo nature is mean!”.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

@Dodo Hunter re: Adam’s blog post, tl;dr: “Society makes men miserable because it demands that men not follow their natural urges to rape and send dick pics. This is no one’s fault, society just drifted this way. Eventually, all men will be chemically castrated (except when for breeding purposes – they’ll stop taking pills and ejaculate into jars for that) and pumped full of oxytocin so that they will more effectively pair bond.”

Catalpa
Catalpa
6 years ago

“Pussy inflation”

AGH WHY WOuLD YOU GIVE ME A MENTAL IMAGE LIKE THAT

dhag85
dhag85
6 years ago

@darkstatistic

Perfectly stated.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

Whoops, ninja’d several times.

*shakes fist at stale page*

dhag85
dhag85
6 years ago

@SFHC

Getting stoned and watching How To Train Your Dragon.

So jealous of your plans for the evening. Wait. Isn’t it like noon for you? Now I’m even more jealous. :p

cendare
6 years ago

Re: Pussy inflation
…brought about an image like this for me.

http://cubiclebot.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/152-600×333.jpg

Kat
Kat
6 years ago

But if you take away my access to hugging, I will probably start killing, just to feel something. I’m designed that way. I’m a normal boy. And I make no apology for it.

Scott Adams, who is taking away your access to hugging? WTF?

And if you start killing, well, OK. Tell the judge that you’re a normal boy and make no apology. See you on death row maybe?

Pro tip (should you decide to pop the question): Get down on one knee, not two. If you’re on two knees, then you’re probably going to start leaning back on your heels. You’d look dopey proffering a diamond ring to some lucky woman while trying not to fall over. Hope that helps!

Kat
Kat
6 years ago

I see that there’s more (complicated) context to Scott Adams’ rant. But it doesn’t really matter. It’s just nasty stuff.

mockingbird
mockingbird
6 years ago

@dhag – When we were dating, aside from paying for everything (he was a grad student with no money, I was a student but had *some* money because I also had a full time job), my now-husband did quite a few of those things, at least the more physically-oriented parts.

He’d open doors – car and building -, pull my seat out, offer me his jacket, etc. He still often does this things, honestly.
It’s what suits us. For him, I think they’re expressions of care and consideration rather than statements about my being helpless or weak; though, if I look at it with am attempt at clinical objectivity, I may enjoy them because they do allude to his size relative to mine and, therefore, set my mind onto some of his other stereotypically masculine traits.
I love HIM – his caring nature, his sensitive soul, his wonderful intellect and wit – and the substantial part of my attraction to him springs from there, but I do have to admit that the slight rumble that his voice can have, his strong hands and his forearms that have the right amount of hair, and select…other…features tickle my limbic system.

Chaos-Engineer
Chaos-Engineer
6 years ago

When I go to dinner, I expect the server to take my date’s order first. I expect the server to deliver her meal first.

Every once in a while I realize that I’m a beneficiary of yet another privilege that I never realized existed.

Up until now, I’ve literally never noticed who got their order taken first, or who got their meal delivered first. It seemed too unimportant for me to think about. I think it’s because I move in social circles where there’s a rule of etiquette that says you don’t start eating until everybody has been served.

I guess Scott Adams lives under some more oppressive sort of rule? Maybe the waiter takes one person’s order, waits for it to be cooked, serves it, waits for that person to finish eating, and then moves on the second person assuming that there’s still food in the kitchen?

That’s really sad. I’m wondering if there’s anything I can do to help.

Men like hugging better than they like killing. But if you take away my access to hugging, I will probably start killing, just to feel something. I’m designed that way.

This part is structured like a joke, but it doesn’t seem all that funny. It might have worked better before the Elliot Rodger incident.

Walter
Walter
6 years ago

Katz

Yeah, what he wrote is already horrible. There’s no need to try it make it more horrible by adding stuff he didn’t actually write.

ej
ej
6 years ago

@dhag

Do some people actually date like this? With the weird chivalry and everything? You Mammotheers who are actually dating, or have dated in the past, is this a real thing?

I’ve been on very few first dates where I didn’t already know the person, so I’ve never really had a date like the one he described. I’ve been on some bad dates, but I don’t think I’ve ever had one where I felt like the guy was trying to buy access to my body, which is good. Then again, this may because I usually went on dates with people that I had met at school or dancing or something, so I already had a pretty good idea of their personality and could avoid ones who might act like that.

As for the chivalry, my partner used to open the car door for me. I commented on it because I had never had someone do that before, but it may also have been because his car doesn’t have automatic locks, so it was easier to let me in first rather than climbing over the seat to unlock my door. He doesn’t really do it much any more, but we’re also not traveling together by car much these days.

We used to race to see who could get to the check first when we went out. I didn’t want him to think he had to pay all the time, especially when I knew I was making more than him. We have our own little system worked out now (after nearly 3 years), so it’s not a problem any more. I do get annoyed occasionally when I pay and the server comes back with receipt and hands it to my partner to sign. They obviously didn’t look at the name one the card and assumed that he was the one paying for dinner. Most of the time when that happens, I will pointedly take the receipt and the pen, not rudely, but enough so that the server will notice. It’s not that big of a deal, but it’s still sexist for them to assume he is paying.

katz
katz
6 years ago

I’ve never really “dated” in that sense. For me it’s always been the case that you talk to someone at work, at school, online, at a coffee shop, at a bar, etc, and eventually you realize you like each other.

Same here. I just don’t think “dating to get to know someone” is that common anymore.

Walter
Walter
6 years ago

Darkstatic

I think the view of sex as a location isn’t really the problem. The thinking that leads to “pussy inflation” or whatever nutty idea red-pillers come up with remain the same if sex is a location or an activity.

monopole
monopole
6 years ago

Just before I read this post, I saw this dilbert that parroted the MRAs/PUAs
http://i.imgur.com/AOV6JlM.jpg
He really has become the second coming of Johnny Hart
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2015/04/23/now-we-know-who-still-reads-b-c/

Walter
Walter
6 years ago

Katz

With online dating, I think that kind of thing is very common. Honestly, every date I’ve been on has been of the “dating to get to know someone” variety.

Shalimar
Shalimar
6 years ago

Men also have to get permission from other men they want to fuck. No matriarchy involved.

Virtually Out of Touch
Virtually Out of Touch
6 years ago

Free hugs dude has a great physique! Is that all we get for free? 😉

Ghost Robot
Ghost Robot
6 years ago

I’ve always found the Free Hugs thing immensely creepy, no matter who is doing it. Then again, I don’t like to be hugged, even by people I know, so maybe I’m a little tetchy like that.

As for Adams, he kinda a reminds me of Australian cartoonist Michael Leunig, in that he communicates simple stuff well in his art (whimsical, emotive humour in Leunig’s case, wry observations about office politics and corporate culture in Adams’s), but is a hopeless, bumbling embarrassment (with embarrassing opinions) when speaking outside of his purview. Sure, he may well see himself as a man of rationality and science, but that doesn’t make it so. Hell, I know a guy just like that, and he’s a goddamn homeopath by profession.

C. Nerf Herder
C. Nerf Herder
6 years ago

I am so disappointed. I LOVE dilbert, this sucks. WTF, dude?

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