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MRA: Making women suffer is a highly ineffective way to put them in their place

Making women cry: Highly ineffective.

Given the enmity towards women in general, and feminists in particular, that’s omnipresent in the manosphere, it seems logical to assume that most of the dudes lingering around MRA, PUA and MGTOW sites online would take a certain secret pleasure in seeing women suffer.

As regular readers of this blog know all too well, oftentimes the desire to see women suffer is not so secret: some MRAs and others of their ilk  literally laugh at women getting cancer, declare that rapists should be given medals, openly fantasize about “beat[ing] the living shit” out of women,  and tell feminists who complain about this sort of shit that they’re “so pernicious and repugnant that the idea of fucking your shit up gives me an erection.” (Those last two examples come from Paul Elam, one of the MRM’s most influential bloggers.) Still others send rape and death threats to outspoken women online.

But good news, folks! It turns out that not all manosphere misogynists want women to suffer. Why? Because suffering is an ineffective way to put women in their place. That, at least, is the argument of a fellow calling himself Höllenhund. In a comment on Susan Walsh’s Hooking Up Smart blog, he offered this argument:

Making women suffer wouldn’t achieve anything in itself – I’m pretty sure the overwhelming majority of the Manosphere would agree. Women are normally solipsistic and they fail to understand their own urges and don’t comprehend the connection between cause and effect. They’d never understand why they’re suffering in the first place.

So, basically, in his mind, women are dumber than dogs and thus harder to train. Even worse, the suffering women can sit down in the street and cry, and countless “white knights,” hoping to win their approval (and get in their pants) will rush to their aid:

Suffering only motivates them to fish for male sympathy (and thus investment) through crying and whining, to blame ‘ bad men’ for their ‘misfortune’ and thus play the game of ‘let’s you and him fight’. That’s how it has always been.

So making women suffer is largely pointless. I’d go further and say it’d actually be detrimental to men because it encourages white-knighting and intra-male competition. …

And some of the ladies even seem to sort of like it:

Not to mention the fact that many women actually seem to find some sort of twisted pleasure in suffering, that all this’d simply serve to justify more anti-male legislation and whatnot.

Poor Höllenhund doesn’t have much hope that women will ever see how totally terrible they really are

[T]he notion of making women ‘admit their faults’ is pie-in-the-sky as well. Again, I’m sure pretty much everyone in the Manosphere would agree. You have a bigger chance of seeing pigs fly.

If women are to recognize their faults in this SMP [Sexual Marketplace], they need to have a realistic picture of both their own sexuality and the SMP in the first place, plus they need to have empathy for beta males …

Er, you’re lecturing us about empathy?

Sorry, on with the rest of the sentence:

plus they need to be imbued with the sense of morality without which the very concept of ‘fault’ is meaningless.

And lecturing us about morality too?

I think we’ll sooner see Haiti become a dreaded military superpower.

I’d rather see that than live in a world in which women were so self-hating that they actually believed they were guilty of whatever unnamed sins Höllenhund attributes to them.

NOTE: I found Höllenhund’s comment because the blogger at Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Technology cited it as a prime example of the sort of brave “truth telling” that will get you banned “on feminist sites that supposedly support men.” And yes, it apparently did get poor Höllenhund  banned from Hooking Up Smart. I’m not quite sure how Susan Walsh, a traditionalist  devoted to slut shaming in a thousand different flavors, counts as feminist, but that’s not the point. The point is: I’m regularly accused of “cherry picking” comments from MRAs. In this case, Mr. PMAFT picked the comment for me.

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Kyrie
Kyrie
10 years ago

How about we stop pretending that Solanas matters to feminists and that maybe, just maybe, she killed Warhol not because she hated all men but because she hated Warhol?

Kyrie
Kyrie
10 years ago

I think I speak for all the straight and bi women in manboobz when I say that we definitely don’t want the extinction of men.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
10 years ago

Not that it’s even relevant, but yeah, Solanos shot Warhol over a personal grievance, not because she wanted to exterminate all men.

hellkell
hellkell
10 years ago

MRAs consistently gloss over or ignore the fact that SCUM’s name was given to it by the publisher, not Solanas, since it was published posthumously.

Hippodameia
Hippodameia
10 years ago

She also didn’t kill him, although she did hurt him badly.

ithiliana
ithiliana
10 years ago

@ObserverTroll: Another difference is that you have Solanis as an example.

She’s dead.

David has numerous living misogynists who post often and harass women often on a daily basis (register.her).

There are radical feminists blogging, but their stuff is nothing like what routinely gets posted by misogynists (nor, in fact, do many call for the extermination of men).

So, troll ploy is obvious (do you really think you’re the first to come up with this disingenuous little question? Really? Because you’re not, not even the fifteenth).

ithiliana
ithiliana
10 years ago

In other words how many MORE ‘pieces of literature’ by feminists calling for the extinction of men can you list?

Citation fucking needed.

Dracula
Dracula
10 years ago

Seriously, who gives a shit about Valerie Solanas? She seems to have had greater influence over anti-feminists than anyone else.

Pecunium
10 years ago

Got any more recent quotations than that one?

Got a list of influential feminists who are approbatory of the message in the Manifesto?

Care to show us the feminsts who say men ought to be stripped of rights and treated as slaves and children?

When you have those, get back to us.

Roscoe P. Coltrane
Roscoe P. Coltrane
10 years ago

Testing: <blockquote>

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