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The absolute worst take on the death of Navy SEAL Ryan Owens, courtesy of Reddit’s MGTOWs

Carryn Owens at Trump’s Joint Session address last week

The most memorable moment in #SecondPlacePresident Trump’s speech to Congress last week came when he spoke directly to the widow of slain Navy SEAL Ryan Owens.

Some saw Trump’s tribute to Owens as supremely presidential, others saw it as a “crassly manipulative” ploy to absolve himself from blame for the bungled raid that led to Owens’ death. Some thought he had truly honored the visibly grief-wracked Carryn Owens; others thought he had cynically exploited her for his own political self-aggrandizement.

The regulars in Reddit’s Men Going Their Own Way subreddit have a rather different take on the whole thing.

As they see it, the real issue is that Carryn Owens is an “attention seeking whore [who] most probably cheated on the poor guy like almost all military wives do.”

In a post with several dozen upvotes, the Reddit MGTOW who calls himself No-M3rcy tears into Carryn Owens for her imagined infidelity and alleged attention-seeking.

Ryan fought and died in Yemen while the woman comes on camera and gets all the attention. She becomes a “national hero” and this becomes one of the “best political moments in U.S. history” for doing nothing but crying on camera. Women sure do know how to put up an act. Give it some time and you’ll see her pop up like many military widows on interviews and other things. So much for private grief and respecting your husband.

Trump is the one who turned the whole thing into a political spectacle; Carryn committed no crime other than having feelings in public. How showing her obviously genuine grief is supposed to be disrespectful of her husband I have no idea.

After the Trump speech, everyone forgets about the poor guy and she gets all the media attention for days. The guy is disposable just like all of us and the woman is always the victim. He served his role and now no one gives a shit about him.

Really? Because when I do a Google News search of his name I get this:

This story is not going away, and until we get to the bottom of why the raid failed it shouldn’t.

But the saddest thing is that this attention seeking whore most probably cheated on the poor guy like almost all military wives do. And there he is fighting for her freedom and providing for her. It’s disgraceful how male vets get treated and cheated on.

There is of course zero evidence that she cheated on him; this is just straight up misogyny.

Sometimes they even get Booed when they come back home.

Yeah, that did happen sometimes — during the Vietnam war.  Well, there was one case 5 years ago in which a gay soldier was booed at a Republican debate, though he was booed for being gay, not for being a soldier.

And worst of all, even though she is a post-wall hag (her husband was mid 30’s so she’s probably the same/younger), some Beta simp will probably step in to “save her” from her misery and marry her regardless of the fact that she is a rapidly aging single mother full of wrinkles.

Only a MGTOW could look at a conventionally attractive and not-actually-old-at-all woman insensate with grief and think “yeah, I bet she’s got wrinkles, what a hag, she should die alone!”

Given their bizarre fixation on the alleged “rapid aging” of women and the evils of showing any signs at all of age, I can only wonder what’s going to happen when all these MGTOWs start getting wrinkles themselves.

I hate to tell you this, MGTOW dudes, but men age too, and they don’t all age like fine wine.

She will forget all about her husband and latch onto the new Beta.

Most widows and widowers do move on, which may or may not involve dating or marrying someone else, but they never forget the partner they lost.

What a Gynocentric society we live in. Women will just use you as a resource. Even if you are dead, they will still use you for attention.

Trump is the person who turned everyone’s attention to her; he’s the only one using anyone here.

I think that if she really cared about him she would have stayed home and grieved in private and not use him for sympathy points.

Well, it’s good that no one but your fellow MGTOW losers gives a shit what you think.

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5 years ago

Again a favored wordwide tactic, aside from the US. Oh and the fact remains that again you’re using the same arguments as people who keep defending systemic police brutality “oh talk shit about cops when people break onto your house you wouldn’t say those things.” It’s not exactly doing you favors to keep up the fantasy savior scenario.

Mate I’ll concede on that last one as a cheap shot. But on the demographics of domestic terrorism in the US I stand by the fact that even if I take any of yours as a possibility, the stats say otherwise.

Dalillama: Irate Social Engineer


The point is that this never should have happened in the first place”

The point is that constant valorization of military deaths (and military actions in general) ensures that this will happen over and over and over again. As indeed it keeps doing.


am surprised by how the discussion seem to imply America is special in the glorification of his soldier

All imperialists do it, the U.S is just the biggest on the block atm.


anything about him that’s worth criticizing is shared by countless others in the US military, so why is he being singled out?

Because he’s headline news, and that started a conversation. And in the course of that conversation, people who make much of their progressiveness began to talk in a way that normalizes fascism. And that shit needs to be called out.

@ Handsome Jack

’s not soldiers who start wars, it’s not soldiers who plan strikes, it’s the upper managment. Might as well yell at the person at the drive through for company policy, to kinda be flippant about it.

Thing is, a lotta people have to get shitty, dangerous jobs because of capitalism. And a lot of people die because of that. But I never find myself exhorted to respect a trucker who died in a fiery crash, to remember with honour the names of those who choked out their lives in a cobalt mine for my tablet. Despite the fact that both those people literally died so we could have our 21st century lifestyle, something no U.S. soldier has done for the better part of a century.


I mean, seriously, the adoration and all, come on. That’s the kind of hero cult that ends up justifying pretty much anything – make people feel like the military is actually fighting their war, whatever that is, and not, say… expanding or protecting the interests of a few assholes.


You were being an unbelievable ass. I don’t care about your philosophical stance right now, you were out of line.

Fuck that. If not now, when? If I brouht this up in another thread, then it would be ‘ oh, why are you bringing that up now?’ But it’s a discussion that needs to happen.

Nobody needs you to pick a fight here, cos that’s what you did.

If pointing out imperialist rhetoric is ‘picking a fight’ and unjustified, then perhaps this isn’t the blog I thought it was.

and this isn’t fuckin about you, OK?

No, it’s not about me. It’s about the victims of American colonial wars, and whether we value them more or less than the perpetrators. So far, the popular answer seems to be less, which frankly disgusts me. Gassing on about the heroic troops and their honourable service, regardless of what said ‘service’ actually entails, is supporting imperialism, and indeed normalizing fascism, and I’m sick unto fucking death of hearing it from people who are supposed to be progressive.

@Nobody who has a clue
You’re not great at reading comprehension, are you? The ‘fuckers’ in the first post of mine you replied to are ‘white people from economically depressed areas’, not ‘soldiers’. Given that the ‘white working class’ has enthusiastically helped drag their (and my) troubles down onto themselves, I have no sympathy left for said troubles.
As for the rest of your nonsense, you appear to be unaware that the U.S. military has acted against U.S. residents vastly more often than invaders on U.S. soil (Having only done the latter twice in all of our history). And, given that we’ve got fascists in charge of the place right now who’ve said outright they want me dead, I’ve gotta say that the concern that their going to come for me is a lot greater than the hope that they’ll defend me from anything. Incidentally, who is it that you think is capable of invading to start with? Canada? Mexico? ISIS? Who?
Oh, and I love the implications that the most heavily funded military on Earth, with a dozen aircraft carriers poised to strike anyhwere on the planet at a moments notice, is there for ‘defence’. Shithead.

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
5 years ago

@Nobody Special

Only that isn’t what I said, is it? Not even close. Where did you learn your debating skills? Pharyngula comments?

You what ?

That’s exactly what you said. “You’ll thank them when you actually need them !” is what you said, and that’s exactly what I replied to.

5 years ago

Blah blah blah everyone is eeeevil but me! Me!!!! MEEEEE!!! -Dalillama

(Pay no attention to that Russia or China behind the curtain, we are the Great and Powerful DON’T NEED NO DEFENSE FORCE)

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
5 years ago


“Defense force” huh ?

Hi, I’m French. I have a few words about your defense force.

I also have many more words about the assessment that you made of Dali’s argument but those violate the comments policy by a few miles.

Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
5 years ago


Fuck that. If not now, when?

Not a matter of timing (I can see the source of confusion, my b) but of being an ass. You weren’t discussing anything, you were lecturing. In the extra condescending, questions that aren’t really questions way I can’t fuckin stand. Same shit @Special was up to. Fuck that

Speaking of things I hate

Blah blah blah everyone is eeeevil but me! Me!!!! MEEEEE!!!

Ain’t nobody got time for this. Just fuckin say it, yo *sigh*

Entirely separate, but still on topic:
But her emails, tho…

Laugher at Bigots, Mincing Betaboy

[Pokes head in]

[Notices unprecedented levels of acrimony]

[Backs away slowly]

5 years ago

Hi, I’m from one country this defence force was in. I think they called it “The Domino Effect.”

Brony, Social Justice Cenobite
Brony, Social Justice Cenobite
5 years ago

I’m with Dalillama’s in that the discussion needs to happen. When is the tine?

I think everyone should know for themselves when it becomes dishonorable to be in the military, and how one should spread the idea that it is dishonorable to be in the military.

What else could Tdump press for our soldiers to do? How should we use those military deaths symbolically? The concerns are reasonable. Confronting people with the effects of military service has to happen. Dead soldiers still do things we need to face as a culture.

Dalillama: Irate Social Engineer


“oh talk shit about cops when people break onto your house you wouldn’t say those things.”

Indeed I would. Nor, in fact, would I ever call the police in such an instance. It would expose me to considerable potential for bodily harm, and would have no possible positive effect on the situation.


You weren’t discussing anything, you were lecturing.

Sometimes subtlety is the wrong tool.

In the extra condescending, questions that aren’t really questions way I can’t fuckin stand.

Ersatz Socratic dialogue isn’t my favourite either, but it’s quite popular and appears to work for many people.

Your bullshit is hardly worth addressing, since you clearly have not the first fucking clue what you’re talking about. Hint: Russia and China combined have less than half the military budget of the U.S. China also lacks sufficient sea carriage to transport an invading force across the Pacific Ocean, while Russia is, in case you hadn’t noticed, our good buddy right now. Also, their army is only about the size of our National Guard (which, speaking of defence forces, is the only one actually authorized by the Constitution, if that’s something you care about).

Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
Sinkable John : Pansy Ass Pinko, Regicidal Beast-of-Burden
5 years ago


I suppose you’re also fully in favor of nuclear deterrence theory and gun ownership without any control ?

For the sake of your own consistency, I hope you are.

5 years ago

I know I’m not in favor of judging everyone in the military as fascist imperialist racist murders because it suits my own personal bias, and I’m not in favor of glossing over a deeply nuanced and complicated issue like military psychology, national policy, and world politics with over generalized and inaccurate nonsense because it’s easier for me to be a self righteous and biased ass who can’t even show basic kindness, consideration, empathy to people as individuals… and higher level thinking, logical research, and understanding into the info of the subject matters at hand.

So there’s that.

I think a lot of you are so obsessed with being right and morally superior you’ve become basically insufferable as people. Dalillama is so convinced that they are a righteous warrior bravely standing up for truth that she deliberately disrespects both a decreased man, his widow (neither of whom she actually knows as people) and PeeVee’s polite request to disengage. Go you, D. I’m sure history will ring with your bravery and nobility in future generations to come.

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