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Prolific incel commenter has an unexpected moment of clarity: maybe a constant diet of despair is bad for you?

By David Futrelle

Sometimes, even in the deepest recesses of Incels.co, a little light can shine. Today, while making my way through such lovely topics of discussion as “With the way young girls dress, I wonder how many fathers secretly jerk off to their daughter” and “Why do ugly fat white women feel entitled to tyrones?” I ran across a post with the intriguing headline “Anyone else think that this site is a drain upon their mental health.”

Had one of the site’s regular users — a fellow named “goydivision” with nearly 1200 posts to his name — stumbled into what alcoholics call a “moment of clarity?” It seemed so.

In a rambling but sometimes quite pointed post, goydivision challenged some of the site’s “black pill” shibboleths and suggested that its atmosphere of intnse negativity about everything wasn’t necessairly helping anyone.

Like seriously, irl I don’t get mogged too much (truth be told I often mog landwhales both male and female) and I don’t really know any Chads irl. I see them around here and then but I don’t have to deal with them talking about their exploits all the time.

I actually think that the few people who have overwhelming negative experiences here, instead of normally keeping it to themselves, it is amplified multiple times to the other 199 or so people here.

He went further, challenging the regular cries of “it’s over” from his fellow commenters.

While the argument can be made that being ugly and incel or taking the blackpill is the source of this negativity, for the first, I honestly believe that around half (or less than half) of users here are merely misplaced normie mentalcels who honestly could betabuxx if they got off their ass, and a very small percentage being potential slayers who are just too retarded to do anything.

Honestly, I feel like the sheer despair of the blackpill is severely overexaggerated due to the very nature of this forum encouraging the “its over” mindset.

But, alas, goydivision hasn’t yet freed himself of most incel dogma.

The blackpill in itself shouldn’t keep you down because its more of a liberation, and instead of crying over spilt milk, it should rather be turned into growth in a positive way (whatever you want, careermaxxing, schoolmaxxing, etc).

I mean, if anything, we all should be fairly pleased (except for the fakecel high tier normies) that foids don’t want us, because, I mean, think about it logically. They’re all whores with no concept of loyalty and who obsess over Chad, so shouldn’t we instead realize that liberation from the rat race of chasing hypergamous females is a gift instead?

Well, that’s not great, obviously, but it’s a tiny step forward. A very tiny step.

Some of goydivision’s incel colleguages agreed that the site can be a little negative in tone and that, as one of them put it, “too much blackpills is not good for you all st once.” But others pecked at his argument in their normal nihilistic fashion.

“Having sub-par looks is a real drain on my mental health,” one commenter retorted. “I’m a subhuman and I hate my life,” added another.

A commenter called Atavistic Autist offered a bold if somewhat loopy strategy to overcome the despair of the blackpilled life:

I suggest that we get to the point where we can read the most brutal blackpill thread and feel nothing, not because we are dead inside, but because we have ceased to have a moral sense as based in disgust responsivity and considerations of social status at all.

We must become Nietzsche’s Superman, self-centered and yet not egotistical.

Or maybe don’t do that, because that’s one of the dumbest and most pretentious things I’ve ever heard from one of you guys.

Obviously goydivision has not shed himself of all or even most of the most hateful tenets of incel ideology. As his references to “foids” and “landwhales” suggest, he’s still pretty much a hateful asshole; indeed, in the comments he confesses that the main reason he still reads and posts on Incels.co is that it’s “the only forum where I can openly discuss my hatred of females.”

But he’s beginning to challenge some of the incel dogma, and that’s something. Maybe he’ll go further; maybe others will follow in his footsteps. They say that optimism is the triumph of hope over experience, and it probably is, but I’m going to allow myself a little bit of hope here.

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Naglfar
Naglfar
2 years ago

There’s definitely antisemitism, misogyny, and ableism; but it seems that this person has a far more positive outlook than most incels. Maybe he’ll find his way out into the real world one day.

a very small percentage being potential slayers

Potential slayers?comment image

The blackpill in itself shouldn’t keep you down because its more of a liberation, and instead of crying over spilt milk, it should rather be turned into growth in a positive way (whatever you want, careermaxxing, schoolmaxxing, etc).

The language in the paragraph is still incel speak, but it’s almost surreal to read it because it’s less abhorrent than most of what incels say. In isolation, it’s almost motivational (though the next paragraph rather breaks the spell).

We must become Nietzsche’s Superman, self-centered and yet not egotistical.

I don’t think that’s what Nietzsche meant.

Naglfar
Naglfar
2 years ago

For some reason my last comment says it’s being held for moderation. I’m not sure why, but hopefully I didn’t write anything in violation of the comments policy or get myself on permanent moderation or something.

ETA: this comment appeared normally, so maybe the filter is just overactive. It’s probably no big deal.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

The blackpill in itself shouldn’t keep you down because its more of a liberation, and instead of crying over spilt milk, it should rather be turned into growth in a positive way (whatever you want, careermaxxing, schoolmaxxing, etc).

It’s a vicious cycle. They start out as red pillers and when that doesn’t get them drowning in 18 year old virgin sex goddesses as promised, they go to the black pill and become incels. Then apparently, when that doesn’t work they start to do the red pill thing again.

comment image

epronovost
epronovost
2 years ago

I wouldn’t be surprised that most incels, like most PUA, just “grow out of it” as they age, gain self-confidence, get treated for underlying mental health issues or simply break a circle of fear, resentment, entitlement and self-pity. Note that this doesn’t necessarily makes them nice people who treat others, especially women and girls, with respect, but it they stop being incels and PUA.

ian5
ian5
2 years ago

Pretentious as “becoming the ubermensch” is I keep coming back to the bit about “moral sense as based in disgust responsitivity and consideration of social status.” Seems like to this guy not being sufficiently disgusted by and ragging on “landwhales” would be seen as forgoing his moral duty. Gotta keep people in their places and feel lots of disgust: morality!

(I do recall reading material about morality originating in a sense of disgust, but for most people I don’t think it stops there.)

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
2 years ago

Someone better alert the MGTOW forums that there’s a bunch of incels about to join them.

Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
Kat, ambassador of the feminist government in exile
2 years ago

“Anyone else think that this site is a drain upon their mental health.”

No way. Why would commenters urging other commenters to kill themselves be a downer. Who wouldn’t appreciate that type of lighthearted witticism.

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
2 years ago

@epronovost

No data of course, but I’m with you. That seems the likeliest outcome.

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
2 years ago

I must have missed something in the past. Do I want to know what “mogged” means?

Shadowplay
2 years ago

Amog – Alpha Male of the Group. If someone else it it, you’ve been mogged.

Some bullshit they invented.

Lumipuna
Lumipuna
2 years ago

Sounds like this guy reinvented MGTOW. Progress?

Mogging in incel slang for when a relatively attractive man is present in social situations in a way that seems to dominate the sexual dynamics, metaphorically rubbing it in your face that he’s more sexually competitive than you. Incels feel they’re being “mogged” every time they have to witness a man being attractive and/or interacting positively with women.

Catalpa
Catalpa
2 years ago

It feels a little weird seeing these hateful dudes talking about MGTOW philosophy, because I’m personally a very big fan of being happily single. I’m asexual and ~90% sure I’m also aromantic, and a lot of the time I’m super relieved that I don’t have to stress about dating or finding someone compatible or worrying if it might be too late for some arbitrary relationship milestone, because I have no interest in finding a romantic partner.

The only thing that causes me some grief is that our culture is highly amatonormative, and it’s heavily emphasized that a romantic connection is supposed to be the most meaningful relationship in your life. That friendship isn’t considered possible to be as deep or meaningful as a romantic partnership. That so much of the world is set up for couples. And if it’s aggravating for me, who doesn’t feel any desire to participate, I can only imagine that it’s much worse for people who want that lifestyle but can’t find a partner.
So I do wish that there was more societal acceptance of meaningful single experiences being valid.

And then I hear these dickheads talking about superficially similar philosophy and it makes me uncomfortable, because I don’t want to be sharing common ground with these assholes.

Anna
Anna
2 years ago

Nah, he will transit into MGTOW

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
2 years ago

For some reason it’s always Nietzsche they bring up, though Schopenhauer would be more their speed. If there’s one thing that permeates incel ideology its resentment which Nietzsche wasn’t fond of, to put it mildly. Same goes for MGTOW who define their entire ‘thinking’ by resenting women.

Look, Nietzsche is an interesting thinker, but I cannot help but feel a lot of these people would be better of reading Sartre or Camus, who both actually attempted to build a bridge to the other side of nihilistic despair instead of saying ‘Everybody has to find their own way’ like Nietzsche or wallowing in despair like Schopenhauer.

Though if someone genuinely struggles with suicidal tendencies, I would be very hesitant to recommend Camus’ Myth of Sisyphus considering it’s subject matter. It helped me a lot, but therapy is better (which also helped me a lot, eventually).

@Catalpa: Yeah it blows that society is so unaccepting of people who genuinely are fine on their own. I hope your social circle is more accepting.

Amtep
Amtep
2 years ago

I expect they’ve never heard of those other philosophers. They know about Nietzsche from their neo-Nazi friends.

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

Yeah, what fraction of people who quote Nietzsche have read more than a few sentences? I’m guessing 10% or less.

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
2 years ago

Naglfar
Naglfar
2 years ago

@Catalpa

So I do wish that there was more societal acceptance of meaningful single experiences being valid.

I agree, I do think a part of the problem is the emphasis that someone’s value is contingent on relationships they have, and would support efforts to deconstruct that norm for multiple reasons. I’m not sure what the best way to do that is, though I’m sure someone has already started.

As for him reinventing MGTOW, it’s still not good, but I guess it’s better than him being an incel simply because fewer MGTOWs go on shooting rampages or canonize murderers. Now if only he could just be a decent human being.

Naglfar
Naglfar
2 years ago

O/T: TERFs now are writing op-eds claiming that COVID-19 is part of a conspiracy along with trans* people to steal women’s rights. They also are anti-vaxxers, though that doesn’t surprise me given their general denial of modern medicine.

Cindy
Cindy
2 years ago

My personal feelings on incels aside, someone leaving a hate group is always a good thing.

Halloween Jack
Halloween Jack
2 years ago

The posters on /r/inceltear note that, every now and then, a crab makes it out of the bucket.

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

But what if that bucket is inside a bigger bucket?

Naglfar
Naglfar
2 years ago

@Moggie
It’s buckets all the way down!

Battering Lamb
Battering Lamb
2 years ago

I expect they’ve never heard of those other philosophers. They know about Nietzsche from their neo-Nazi friends.

Speaking of people Nietzsche likely would not approve of. I mean, the guy has his issues (and his attitude towards jews is dubious (he broke with Wagner among other thing because of Wagners antisemitism) but there are some dodgy remarks in unpublished works) but he’s not a fan of blindly following anything, which is one of the reasons his texts are often self-contradictory. And his texts can often have real zingers of one liners that have a very different meaning when you read it in the context of the rest. He’s a profoundly frustrating philosopher to make sense of, but a very entertaining one to read (and hence popular to quote). Which is not an ideal combination. Say what you will about 20th century analytical philosophy, but at least they have decency to tell you in an unambiguous way what the main takeaway from their papers should be. Often dry as kindling, though. Sorry for the philosophy nerding.

@Alan Robertshaw: That is a classic but I’d advise against using it as a benchmark for the mentioned philosophers. 😉

@Moggie: The bucket was inside them all along.

Moggie
Moggie
2 years ago

OT: Why is Team Trump using a Nazi symbol to rally their base?

https://twitter.com/jewishaction/status/1273482511918616578

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