I made a video! Is it wrong that I love these stupid Xtranormal cartoon dudes and their robotic voices?
Anyway, here’s AussieSteve, from MGTOWforums.com, offering some opinions about the bitches of today.
Here’s the quote in boring non-animated typed-out word format:
Hey girls, you were told motherhood was slavery and you could do anything a man could do. I guess you’re feeling pretty betrayed by your feminist sisters now aren’t you? Well tough shit, actions have consequences – deal with it. One thing’s for sure, I aint bailing you out. I actually LIKE watching you suffer, it’s called justice. As it turns out it’s ME that doesn’t need YOU!! And further to the point, you’ve revealed your true colours and I don’t like them. Never been a fan of bile green myself.
Now fuck off and buy a cat, it’s the only thing that will put up with your crap. I’m outa here – bye bitches, you’re on your own.
If you all find this little cartoon even vaguely amusing, I will make more and better ones.
Yohami, do you think that guys like Silvio Berlusconi are hated because of their success with women ? If a guy has success with women, everybody will celebrate him.
@Rachel:
I believe that was chocomintlipwax who said that, not me…
Woops, that was chocomintlipwax with the quote, not Kirby! My bad!
Nomoreniceguy,
Add Silvio Berlusconi to the John Mayer, Hugh Hefner, George Clooney list etc.
I cant give my opinion on the guy though. I know Roissysphere adores the guy, but I have no clue if the media likes him or not. Whatever the case, he´s an outlier like the others in the list. I dont see the alpha adoration being ingrained in the culture anymore, but more of a demonized sub-culture.
What do guys here think about Berlusconi?
Yohami, if you’re going to use broad generalizations, fine. Rock with it. But be consistent. Hefner, Clooney, Mayer, et. al, are in fact celebrated for their status as dedicated bachelors. And Jennifer Aniston, despite being rich, famous, and lovely is kind of continuously tsk-tsked by the press for being: 1) left by her husband and 2) her seemingly perpetual single status. And no matter how often people gush about Helen Mirren (and she’s well worth the gushing) or how quickly the term MILF was adopted, older women are still routinely cautioned about pursuing or being pursued by younger men.
None of the rich, powerful, and/or famous are going to be truly “representative” of men or women. Here, in the world inhabited by most of the rest of us, being single -especially past a certain age- will be subject to a variety of judgments. Some will be positive, some will be negative and, I don’t know, I don’t find it particularly valuable to try and figure out “who has it worse.”
I may well be in the minority.
If you are isolated, why hanging out with MRAs ? You just hang out with the wrong crowd.
Did I say I was isolated, or are you just trying to hurt and shame me because you are feeling cranky? Or are you hallucinating?
Nobinayamu,
“None of the rich, powerful, and/or famous are going to be truly “representative” of men or women.”
That.
“I don’t find it particularly valuable to try and figure out “who has it worse.”
I think thats the only point being made on this thread.
Yeah, Yohami, I recognize that. But even for a thread where the original post is basically a one-liner, I think the “who has it worse” discussion is really beside the point. All single people are judged. The thing is the cartoon is based on a comment from someone calling himself AussieSteve who associates with MGOTW. And it’s clear that the guy either didn’t read, or didn’t understand the article. Or didn’t care; that’s also a possibility.
For me, that just makes the cartoon funnier. But the notion that single women in their 30s and 40s are looking to be bailed out, is pretty fucking funny too. Which gender of single people is more “harshly” judged just kind of seems like a non sequitor.
But, I don’t know – it’s super hot, I’m super bored, and I’ve got about an hour to kill before taking my pops to the movies.
At first I thought FactFinder might be AWS: The Fact, but he’s not nearly as crazy. Which is a shame, because AWS was very entertaining, and FactFinder . . . isn’t.
I don’t think the similarity of names is unusual, though. Trolls often have nyms that are just as disingenuous as their arguments, so finding multiple MRA trolls who insist that they’re stating facts is . . .
Yeah.
Oh, man, I almost forgot about AWS. Wasn’t he suggesting/daring/begging David to make a thread about him, for a while there?
The troll may be gone, but
d” rel=”nofollow”>his legacy remains.
The thing about single men and women at work — I agree with the basic idea that married people (men, in particular — married women are risky because of pregnancy) have it easier in business and in politics, in some ways. A married guy needs the promotion because he’s supporting his family, he’s stable, he’s trustworthy, he’s normal, whatever. A married woman is — well, again, maybe she’s not entirely trustworthy, but at least she’s normal. These are stereotypes that exist. If there’s no single-person prejudice, there’s at least kind of weird insinuations that a single person has to deal with. I get it.
And yet, here we have an MRA flinging this accusation at a feminist site, as though it’s feminism’s fault, or feminists support this. It’s a really old assumption, and it’s something that — I don’t know that feminism has done anything specific to deal with it, but in that feminism is about challenging traditional gender roles and rethinking assumptions, it seems to me that feminism lives comfortably alongside challenging the notion that people in general need to be married to be normal and employable and successful.
Nobinayamu,
Yeah, the who has it worse is pretty boring. I just wanted to chime in that being a corporate single man != being James Bond
Someone here said that men have all the fun or something like that.
I dont know about professionally successful but single women who need a cat, I dont know any.
I do know a bunch of lonely mature guys who have nothing other than a job.
So the cartoon is probably a projection, and maybe a few, few women are reaching a destiny that was more common for men until now.
Once again MGTOW is not about men choosing to go their own way, it’s about how wymmminz are x,y,z and how much wymmminz suck?
What is the technical difference between an MGTOW and an old fashioned bachelor ?
Bee, I think it’s true that married people are often considered -if not more “normal”- at the very least more stable than single people. Especially after a certain age; certainly in professional environments. I wouldn’t deny that. I just think that single people, regardless of gender, are subject to near equal amounts of positive and negative stereotyping.
I’ve gotten all of the “Still single? No children? You know you’re clock’s ticking,” type stuff. I’ve heard women say, “I mean he’s nice and everything but, forty, never been married, never been close? I just don’t know girl…” I think it cuts both ways.
As far as an MRA-type showing up and placing the blame at the feet of feminism? Water’s wet, sky’s blue, everything in the world MRA-types don’t like is because of feminism.
Like you, though, I often find the compulsion to assign the blame for ordinary hardships -like being single if one considers it a hardship- to feminism aggravating. But also kind of sad.
The difference is that old fashioned bachelors (I assume you mean the Henry Higgins model) don’t spend their every waking moment obsessing over women.
Nobinayamu, I completely agree with the idea that the stereotype exists for men and women both — and in what amounts …? Well, it’s kind of pointless to argue that. Not to mention impossible, since the mileage is so very prone to vary from person to person, position to position, situation to situation, etc.
I’ve agreed with what you’ve been saying. I was more commenting in reaction to what FactFinder said.
“‘What is the technical difference between an MGTOW and an old fashioned bachelor ?”
“The difference is that old fashioned bachelors (I assume you mean the Henry Higgins model) don’t spend their every waking moment obsessing over women.”
He just pulls one out of the gutter and makes her over from fashion to speech patterns. STEP UP YOUR GAME, MRAS! 😛
*That should have been “the stereotypes exist for men and women both,” since you (Nobinayamu) were talking about both the negative and positive stereotypes.
I could probably write two or three editorial changes every time I post a comment.
Hey Bee, we’re totally in agreement. No need for any editorial changes.
Molly Ren? That was hilarious.
You know what always strikes me about the “everything I don’t like from my job, to condoms, to stuffed crust pizza is the fault of feminism” MRA-types? If any ethnic minority so much as hints that anything in their life is less than perfect as a result of current or historical prejudice -they’re apoplectic with denial.
Women expecting men to wipe their ass is the fault of feminism encouraging us to be “perfect princesses”. But class and race discrimination was all done away with by quotas.
The message of “the clock is ticking” is “marry someone and have babies or you will be failure as a woman.” Bee pointed out that message is meant to benefit people (to use the term lightly) like AussieSteve.
The woman who is not enthusiastic about a relationship with a single 40 yr old man who has never had a relationship is questioning whether the person be able to adapt to considering and accommodating a partner. The question is meant to benefit the woman.Two different things.
Marriage and partnering are considered the norm in our society. Therefore, anyone single is un-normative and makes everyone uncomfortable. We need a single movement, like the gay movement.
Laughing my head off at “Factfinder” asking for evidence the Daily Mail is unreliable. Yep, he finds the facts, alright.
So now we have Mythic Alphas xD Still waiting on those Dire Alphas xD
This is good card fodder tho :3
I should be cardfinder xD
New alias? Or is it aMias?
Some good points, though a bit dated. Many women started to see how feminism–and the “education” fitting them for the feminist lifestyle–was hurting them in the search for men, families,and relationships as early as the late ’80s and early ’90s. What we are seeing today is the deserted wreakage of what were once women, tryting to come to terms with being to masculine to be useful or appealing to men, and too feminine to be good feminists and ‘modern women’!
Your point about them getting cats to keep them company bothers me a little bit. Cats can be very nice creatures, It is a form of cruelty to animals, surely unintended on your part, to suggest that these sleek, beautiful, and quite interesting creatures enduring the company of bitter, stupid, noisy, opinionated, narcissitically self-absorbed, and just plain REVOLTING feminists! Except for the lowest form of alley cats, most of the pretty kitties are really too good for modern women!
Let ’em keep company with cockroaches, rats, or others on their level!
PEACE AND FREEDOM!!
David K. Meller
Are MGTOW allowed to keep cats ?
I just asked my cat if she had a problem with my feminism, and you know what she said?
“Meow purr purr purr purr *rub against hand* purr.”
I think she’s okay with it.
My cat just ignored me. but then, that’s his opinion on everything
Why am I not surprised that DKM loves pussies and hates the women who own them?
Summer_snow has just won the internet!
Ellish, I’m going to have to respectfully disagree. Generally, when I’ve received the “ticking clock” comments they have not come from men but from women. Now, women are quite capable of internalizing misogyny and policing gender norms. I don’t mean to assert otherwise. But, in my experience, the women who’ve pointed out to me that I’m “not getting in younger” have almost always been the ones who complained the most about the burdens of motherhood. Confirmation bias? Quite possibly. I just know that the women I know who seem happy to be mothers always say things like, “Oh, you’ve got plenty of time. If it’s going to happen, it will happen.” Things like that.
Other than the MRA types online, some of whom seem to think that any woman over the age of 25 is well into her crone-dom, I can only think of a few occasions in which a man has tried to shame me about being single and not having children.
And the example I gave was not of a woman expressing reservations about a man who’d never been in a relationship. I spoke, specifically, about a woman passing negative judgment on a 40 year old man who had never been married or engaged. Is it possible that such reservations are reasonable and well-founded? Sure. But I can’t really cosign on an exclusively charitable interpretation that kind of prejudice. I know that there are women in their 30s and 40s who have never been married and aren’t in some way defective; unable to consider and/or accommodate a partner. The same is true of men.
People are people.
I do agree that one of the benefits of feminism is the challenge presented to these ideas. And we are definitely still living in a culture that views the single with everything from pity to animosity.
A whole internet just for me? Yay! I’m going to keep it next to my copy of The Matrix!
Use it wisely, young grasshopper
@Nobinayamu I have to agree w/ you xD Outside of the PUA/MRAs (who are ridic obsessed w/ this it seems xD ) it is mostly women who say that : esp the ones who insist to you when you say you dun want children that when you reach near 30 you’ll change your mind, and etc >_> The Atlantic had a particularly bad opinion piece by a woman that was like this I remember xD
Of course I always laugh when ppl tell me about my ticking biological clock xD
http://ami-rants.blogspot.com/2011/07/ami-trish-and-zhinxy-snarkle-rape.html#more
New snarkling list is up btw! 😀 (I’ve been getting some demand to do another, so me, Trish and Zhinxy finally got together to do a part 2 xD )
Wait, wait — what am I supposed to be suffering from?
I agree, Ami and Nobinayamu, but just to clarify, what I was saying and eilish was commenting on wasn’t whether the “shriveled up uterus” discussion usually comes from women or men in the RL; but rather what AussieSteve’s specific interest in perpetuating that trope was.
Ami: I said it on the forum, but I love the list.
I have a kid. I don’t care one way or the other whether some dude wants to go his own way. But, I believe that there are two kinds of people, those that had kids, and those that didn’t. I’ve seen women change substantially on issues once they became mothers.
Oh, BTW David,
I am in NYC, and reflecting upon the sad fact that you watch Sex and the City.
😉
Nobinyamu said: I’ve gotten all of the “Still single? No children? You know you’re clock’s ticking,” type stuff.
eilish said: The message of “the clock is ticking” is “marry someone and have babies or you will be failure as a woman.” Bee pointed out that message is meant to benefit people (to use the term lightly) like AussieSteve.
I’m not seeing where we’re at odds on this one.
Should I have added “because the single woman is then meant to rush off and marry the nearest available man, which might make Aussie Steve happy, but I doubt will be good for her because he doesn’t seem like very much fun” ?
Nobinyamu said: I’ve heard women say, “I mean he’s nice and everything but, forty, never been married, never been close? I just don’t know girl…”
I see where we’re at odds here.
You read this as a negative statement based on his gender? As I said, I read it as a friend saying “he might be difficult to live with, as he hasn’t had much practice.” A question about that particular individual: not a statement of fact.
You say “people are people” meaning “how individuals turn out is an accident, not affected by gender”? I believe it’s not an accident: and we are socialised to turn out in particular ways. I think people are taught to be people, and we get taught differently according to our gender.
Any person who has never been in a personal relationship will find it difficult to adapt to compromise and accommodating. I believe women have been socialised to be accommodating, and men have been socialised to be accommodated.
How many of us come from a culture where mothers and sisters serve and care for the domestic needs of the men in the family? What’s the proportion now of boys and men who have been raised to share domestic responsibilities as a matter of course?
It’s better: but gendered domestic expectations are hardly extinct.
Sorry about the lack of blockquotes: I know there’s /] end quote involved but i’ve forgotten the order.
I wonder if we could highlight the bits of our posts that show how we are considering what the other is saying and discussing the points each other raises, as a How To guide for our pet MRAs. Not that they would: but it would really annoy them.
Thanks, Bee!
Thank you, eilish.
If you feel that way about feminists, I can’t imagine why you’d hang around here. Are you a masochist?
Picture a 10-year-old Davey Meller sneaking over to Old Man Futrelle’s house and setting fire to a bag of dog shit on his porch.
I’m cousins with the Mythical Alpha Cock Carousel. Its ornate carved wattles are exquisite.
“Picture a 10-year-old Davey Meller sneaking over to Old Man Futrelle’s house and setting fire to a bag of dog shit on his porch.”
While yelling, “PEACE AND FREEDOM!!!!”
Eilish, (and I’m sorry, by the by, for misspelling your name) we’re still in disagreement but I think I understand why.
AussieSteve may well be representative of the kind person who would tell a woman that her “clock is ticking” but that isn’t borne out by the comment used for David’s cartoon. I presented that trope as an example of one way in which a single woman might be judged. And I pointed out that while I have received that kind of judgment from men, I’ve received it, mostly, from women. Some of those people may very well have meant “You should get married and have children otherwise you’re a failure as a woman.” Some of them may have meant, “I wonder why no one wants to marry and have children with you?” And some of them were trying to see how I felt about marriage and children. And some of them had miserable marriages and/or felt tied down by their children and were actually giving me a backhanded compliment.
My point is not to parse the motivations behind that sort of statement. There are too many. My point is that this is but one of the ways that a single woman, ostensibly of childbearing age, may be judged. And in our culture, we judge single people, regardless of gender.
I say what I mean. So when I say, “People are people,” you don’t have to try and figure out what I “really” mean. And you certainly don’t have to mistranslate me altogether. I didn’t say, “how individuals turn out is an accident, not affected by gender” and I don’t think that anything I wrote provides a basis for that inference.
People are people; with all that entails. Whether it’s a near universal desire for companionship, romantic or otherwise, or the fact that none of us are exempt from our cultural conditioning. People are people and as a result, we are all subject to and guilty of prejudice. I believe that single people –regardless of gender- past the age of… let’s just call it 30 – are routinely judged because, as you pointed out, marriage is considered a “norm” in our culture. Some of that judgment is positive, some of it is negative.
If a man of 40 is being judged because he’s never been married or engaged (and please, once again, I didn’t say “never been in a relationship”) then absent of any other considerations, he is being judged on his single-status. You feel that there are valid reasons for that kind of judgment. I don’t.
I think it’s bull shit to make a variety of baseless assumptions about a woman purely on the basis of her being single, 40, and not having children. And I think it’s bull shit to make a variety of baseless assumptions about a man purely on the basis of his being single, 40, and not have children.
What I appreciate about feminism is the challenge it presents to the gender norms and cultural expectations that form the basis of those kinds of judgments.
Nobinayamu: I am sorry to have offended you.